5u ring modulators

[wutierson]

Hi all!

I'm a Spanish dotcom modular user, with some STG modules and a COTK 921b oscillator.

I hear in some places, something obout how good is the ring modulator of VCS3, CS80, Early Korgs... etc.

At this moment, I believed that a ring modulator is a simple device, more simple than a filter (lot of different filters are available today), but I don't know why some people talk about how wonder is this ring modulator or another...

I have an Arrick ring modulator, and I think that is good. Do you know other ring modulators in 5u format, and with different quality? Better one?

Grettings for all!

[russma]

There's plenty. For starters:

MOTM-190
Oakley Ring Mod
CGS Active Ring Mod
Modcan 07B
YuSynth Dual RM

I only have the MOTM, and I like it fine, but I don't have anything with which to compare it, so I'll leave that commentary to others here.

Welcome to the forum!

[Dr. Sketch-n-Etch]

I have designed a slightly different take on the ring modulator, which I call the "multiplying modulator" (see the discussion here):

viewtopic.php?t=11937

At a certain pot and switch setting, it is a perfectly balanced modulator (four-quadrant multiplier or ring modulator), but it can be twiddled to two-quadrant operation (like a VCA) or something inbetween (unbalanced four-quadrant muliplication). It also has three-way rectifiers and attenuators on both signal and modulator inputs for extra modulation possibilities. Finally, the inputs can be DC or AC coupled. It can be used as a ring-mod in audio mode, or as a voltage-controlled inverting/non-inverting attenuator in CV mode. All in all a pretty useful little toy. It will be going into production in Euro format very very soon (shhh!).

[wutierson]

YuSynth Dual RM looks good! Only problem is that nobody sell it built with dotcom panel, ready to fit into the modular, yet.
If anybody knows tell it, please!

But I ask if these module will do the same result on sound character like two Arrick ringmods.

Any experience in ringmod different models?

Thanks a lot!

[wutierson]

It will be going into production in Euro format very very soon (shhh!)

It looks great! 8_) Why only euro,?? remember the 5u users!!

[JohnLRice]

Welcome!

In addition to Russ' list, here are some modules that have ring modulator types of capabilities:
COTK C1631 Bode Modulator (marked as "not available right now")
Mos-Lab 970 Waveform Processor (marked as "no longer available")

There is also the stand-alone pedal: Moog MF-102

I currently own the MOTM-190 and Mos-Lab 970. Maybe I'll need to do a demo/comparison video . . . .

Edit: I also have the E560 Deflector Shield eurorack module which has a ring modulator mode:
[video][/video]

[Moog$FooL$]

It will be going into production in Euro format very very soon (shhh!)

It looks great! 8_) Why only euro,?? remember the 5u users!!

one could always diy it for 5u.

[russma]

YuSynth Dual RM looks good! Only problem is that nobody sell it built with dotcom panel, ready to fit into the modular, yet....

If you can get or make the PCB and front panel, I'd build the module for you.

[JohnLRice]

YuSynth Dual RM looks good! Only problem is that nobody sell it built with dotcom panel, ready to fit into the modular, yet....

If you can get or make the PCB and front panel, I'd build the module for you.

Russ does great work! He build two envelope generators for me!

[dml]

I'm currently working on a patch this week featuring my underused DotCom Ring Modulator. I used to get some outrageously wonderful deep bell tones from an ARP 2600 RM that I haven't quite been able to replicate on the DotCom. I've worked up some very nice mid range & high bells but I can't quite nail the low end as I could on the ARP. I've discovered that varying amounts of 'soft sync' has a pleasing effect to the overall sound.

Best,

dml

[dml]

I'm currently working on a patch this week featuring my underused DotCom Ring Modulator. I used to get some outrageously wonderful deep bell tones from an ARP 2600 RM that I haven't quite been able to replicate on the DotCom. I've worked up some very nice mid range & high bells but I can't quite nail the low end as I could on the ARP. I've discovered that varying amounts of 'soft sync' has a pleasing effect to the overall sound.

Best,

dml

[russma]

...Russ does great work! He build two envelope generators for me!...

Thanks John, btw, here's the latest build I'm working on:

[JohnLRice]

...Russ does great work! He build two envelope generators for me!...

Thanks John, btw, here's the latest build I'm working on:

Wow! Looks awesome, Russ!

[JohnLRice]

Hey, I forgot that I also have a MOTM-510 which is like a super ring modulator!

http://www.synthtech.com/motm510.html

[sduck]

Wow Russ, that looks great. I've been sitting on 4 of the original 281 pcb's for years - never could come up with a front panel that seemed right - yours looks OK. I've got a bunch of the new dual 281 pcb's on the way - maybe it's time to Make it happen?!

My favorite RM is the MFOS sonic multiplier - it has some neat features and really sounds good. Although like John, the 510 is really great sounding also, only problem is that it has so many other possibilities that just using the RM functions usually gets ignored.

[russma]

I'd like to have one of those 510's myself!

[kindredlost]

It's a coincidence that I happened to be working on my Q116 RM this weekend. I tried plugging up a 100K pot to the INITIAL CONTROL header on the board just to see what would happen. It basically attenuates the X INPUT in a funny way. The mid point of the pot is full attenuation and either end is full signal. I can't determine whether it is inverting the signal or not (most likely not), but it sounds slightly different to my ear on either side of the pot. The Y INPUT is modified regardless of whether the X In signal is attenuated or not. I don't really understand that either.

I later decided to add two pots directly as passive attenuators to the incoming signals. It does nothing really. Of course that is not surprising due to the way a balanced modulator works.

Here is a video of the first test with a pot on the Initial Control header.

[video][/video]



Here is a video of the goofy idea of adding two pots.

[video][/video]

There are 15 LFO's, 6 filters, 2 sequencers, 2 S&H's, 4 delays, a noise source, one EG and two oscillators for the Ring Modulator in this video live recording. A fun patch even though the RM mod was a bust.

I may just put a pot on the Initial Control header for the X Input and leave the Y Input attenuator where it is at. This might prove to be useful in some weird way.

As far as one RM sounding different from another, there are definitely differences. Sometimes it can be misleading to think the modulator is making a lot of difference if the signal sources are different too, but not all designs are the same electronically so it makes sense that there can be audible variations. I know the Arp RM's do sound different from the DotCom Q116 and the PAIA balanced modulators. There are many soft synth tools that have special characteristics too, but that is another subject.

-David

[wutierson]

Hi guys! thanks for your feedback!

By the comments I can know that the ARP rinngmod is so special and recommend.

Thanks a lot Russ, for your offer, but my main problem is the panels. I have some dotcom blank panels but when you're talking about silkscreen... ugh..
I hate the silkscreen process, really... dirty, slow.. making screens, buy the ink... go to the here, then more far to buy next thing... no, no
One day discovered Schaeffer AG, but it seems that only can do works like MOTM panels not Moog style.

If there are any silkscreen master in the forum put your hand up please!

Yusynth have lot of desirable modules, I find the Saw animator so cool! 8_) but I will wait to find a silkscreen solution... one day maybe... Sad too because the Saw animator from Cyndustries is no longer available in dotcom format and she doesn't reply my question if she will do another batch.

The wait continues.

[russma]

Wow Russ, that looks great. I've been sitting on 4 of the original 281 pcb's for years - never could come up with a front panel that seemed right - yours looks OK. I've got a bunch of the new dual 281 pcb's on the way - maybe it's time to Make it happen?!....

Rico had the front panel made from a FPD file on the ModularSynthPanels Yahoo group, by someone named "lexvortex".

And yeah, it's time to make it happen! The quadrature and "or's features are pretty cool.

[pugix]

There's a type of ring modulation (at least that's what I've heard it called) where two pulse waves are processed by digital XOR. I have a CGS Quad Logic gate, which is essentially a quad CMOS logic chip with buffers for analog IO. I put an XOR chip in it. I don't have a simple demo of it working by itself as a ring mod, but here's a recording where it's in there.

http://pugix.com/synth/two-ring-modulations/

That recording also features the MOTM-190 VCA in ring mod mode.

I didn't see a mention of the famous Blacet Klang Werk, probably because it needs repackaging for 5U. I've been on the verge of getting one to convert for 5U for years, but it hasn't bubbled up in priority.

[JohnLRice]

There's a type of ring modulation (at least that's what I've heard it called) where two pulse waves are processed by digital XOR. I have a CGS Quad Logic gate, which is essentially a quad CMOS logic chip with buffers for analog IO. I put an XOR chip in it. I don't have a simple demo of it working by itself as a ring mod, but here's a recording where it's in there.

http://pugix.com/synth/two-ring-modulations/

That recording also features the MOTM-190 VCA in ring mod mode.

I didn't see a mention of the famous Blacet Klang Werk, probably because it needs repackaging for 5U. I've been on the verge of getting one to convert for 5U for years, but it hasn't bubbled up in priority.

That's a really cool sample, Richard! Thanks!

[Ranxerox]

...Russ does great work! He build two envelope generators for me!...

Thanks John, btw, here's the latest build I'm working on:

Shit, that thing is a beast. If you ever decide to build some across to MU I'd seriously consider one of these.

[Synthbuilder]

By the comments I can know that the ARP rinngmod is so special and recommend.

That's what I thought too, which I why I did this:

http://www.oakleysound.com/ringmod.htm

One day discovered Schaeffer AG, but it seems that only can do works like MOTM panels not Moog style.

Scheaffer will take synthesiser.com blanks and engrave them for you. The result is slightly different to a screen printed finish but it's pretty good. See this one:



This was a successful attempt at getting a Moogerfooger pedal into a dotcom format. Not mine but it looks pretty good.

Tony

[megaohm]

Scheaffer will take synthesiser.com blanks and engrave them for you. The result is slightly different to a screen printed finish but it's pretty good. See this one:

What a great idea!!!
Goodbye sharpie-labeled prototypes!!!!

[Mercutio]

...Russ does great work! He build two envelope generators for me!...

Thanks John, btw, here's the latest build I'm working on:

Hi,

It looks awesome.

How do you do that ? It's your own pcb design ?