CP format Modules (Revisited)

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What are your thoughts on CP format

I use CP modules and plan to add more
1
4%
I use CP modules but have no need for any more
5
19%
I don't use CP modules but plan to add them
2
7%
I don't use CP modules and would like to add them but there aren't enough mainstream modules (VCO, VCF, etc...)
1
4%
I don't use CP modules and have no plans to add them
18
67%
 
Total votes: 27

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Flareless
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CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by Flareless »

The CP format is a very interesting aspect of the MU world. I recently delved into it when asked to create a CP version of one of LWSS's existing modules (we do that now).

That got me thinking and searching.

The subject rears its head on occasion here on MW. Discussions about the 2 different size formats, moving utility modules to CP, CP boats, etc... have all crop up every year or two.

I was hoping to learn where in the MU world CP was going if anywhere. Are people planning on adding a CP row to their rigs? Is anyone building CP rows into their new cases / cabinets. Are folks just waiting for more CP offerings to become available?

Or is it just a very niche segment of MU synthesis?

In case you're curious it was a Yusynth VC Panning Mixer / Output Module that we did in MU CP format (CP MU format :hmm: )

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Rich

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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by JohnLRice »

Hey Rich,

I voted 'don't have and no plans' although I did have plans at one point and I do own one Moon CP module I bought used and have temporarily converted to 5U (in the most ugly way possible! :zombie: :hihi: )

That said, I've long thought it would be awesome if someone went full range with CP modules . . .meaning adding VCOs, VCFs, EG's, and VCA's etc! I think it would look pretty awesome to have a modular that is nothing but CP modules? Like a slightly over sized eurorack or slightly undersized Polyfusion? :hyper: With todays modern manufacturing and parts, complex modules like VCOs and VCF need not be super deep anymore and could still fit into the bottom CP row of slanted Moog cases etc?

Special cases that don't really exist yet might need to be created, and the trickiest part is making the case and modules compatible with both Moon (Moog) style CP and COTK style CP since both companies have some really cool CP offerings. I "think" making your modules Moon height and then using oblong mounting holes at the bottom or even just notched all the way through might work (I haven't measured or tried) and then make the cases COTK height so that the taller COTK modules would fit? Or you could just go with one or the other?

I think a modular that is nothing but CP and 3 to 5 rows tall would look sweet! :love: Yes, the below "serving suggestions" is pretty pointless and useless but I wasn't going to take the time to mock up CP versions of VCOs, VCFs, EG's, VCA's and sequencers! :hihi:
modulargrid_1804447.jpg
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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by MOOSEKNUCKLE »

More tactile Eurorack. I get it. Interesting viewpoint...
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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by Sir Ruff »

More CP modules would be nice, but it does feel like a chicken/egg situ where there has to be the case capacity first since CP space will always more precious. An 8U wide, 4-row (CP/full/CP/full) case would be a good start. I think more low U CP modules are also needed—that aren’t just esoteric or basic utility modules.

Rich, that mixer module is very nice and perfect for CP—I would never dedicate the 3U+ needed for that kind of module normally.
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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by Synthacon »

I like the look.

Cases and or rackmount options that are off the peg would also be good.

Also... are there not also two ways of doing them, so some sort of standard maybe?
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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by folpon »

Voted "no plans": Confusing different standards, and I also don't have a case that would accommodate them.
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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by Henfield »

Flareless,

Great Topic, and it is good to see that you can make custom CP sized panels!

Many years ago, I had a custom Moog 15 style cabinet made for me(portable 2x8 space cab plus CP sized row with lid for transportation). For the CP Row, I had used the same height as Moon , as I had already purchased a Moon CP sized Mult module. I also had Ben at Resynthesis make me a custom CP panel, which I then stuffed With Dotcom Modules (Q113, Q115, Q116, and Q118).

My Philosphy of using a CP Row (besides looking like a vintage Moog) was that I wanted a lot of functionality in my portable case, especially as I don’t want an extremely wide or tall cabinet, as I am a shorter guy with a shorter “wingspan”, and it made sense to keep the “utility” functions (as well as modules that you would not change out) grouped together in a CP panel. I would not want to have oscillators, filters, EGs, modulation sources, or other modules that you would be wiggling or periodically swapping out of your system sitting in the CP row.

Below are pics of the cab and the CP panel. I sold them off a number of years ago when I foolishly went into a different format, maybe I need to go that route today!
002560AD-7123-485D-B0A6-BFE737794EBE.jpeg
985127DD-88FC-478C-A19E-80879A01248A.jpeg
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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by Flareless »

Thanks for the excellent feedback everyone!

I personally like the little modules, however, I really don't see myself adding a special row to my rig just to have CP format.

I sort of like the CP Boat idea. I think it'd look way cool.
Rich

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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by Sir Ruff »

Henfield wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:20 am
002560AD-7123-485D-B0A6-BFE737794EBE.jpeg

985127DD-88FC-478C-A19E-80879A01248A.jpeg
That’s a very nice little panel. This is exactly where I think CP is ideal—taking the brunt of the boring utility stuff without taking up a lot of space. I use a Moon 544CP—it essentially serves as the set and forget CV/Gate “hub” of my own model 15 style cab, which I basically use like a very glorified monosynth most of the time. So I use the 544 CV mixer for filter envelope and kbd tracking needs. Very convenient to have those both coming out of one jack, with dedicated amount knobs for both.
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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by xerxl »

I voted before I saw Rich's mixer and started thinking :-) Wouldn't be a bad idea for me at all to stuff a row under my main case. Temting.

Cheers,

Jurgen
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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by KSS »

JohnLRice wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 4:31 am With todays modern manufacturing and parts, complex modules like VCOs and VCF need not be super deep anymore and could still fit into the bottom CP row of slanted Moog cases etc?
Not really. The jacks are the same depth as before and become the limiting factor. They either need to go higher up on the panel, -reversed with jacks on top controls below in the extreme case- or the cabinet can't be slanted.

I'm still a fan of CP modules -since the 60s ;) and feel Roger made a mistake not to include them. Ron Folkman was wiser and included them in Polyfusion which is to me moog v2.

But since Dotcom don't have them, it's gonna be a tough nut for general adoption. Moon and COTK :slapfight: only adding to the WTF.

A CP-based skiff-controller *does* sound sweet!
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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by JohnLRice »

KSS wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 5:26 pm
JohnLRice wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 4:31 am With todays modern manufacturing and parts, complex modules like VCOs and VCF need not be super deep anymore and could still fit into the bottom CP row of slanted Moog cases etc?
Not really. The jacks are the same depth as before and become the limiting factor. They either need to go higher up on the panel, -reversed with jacks on top controls below in the extreme case- or the cabinet can't be slanted.
:hmm: I've never owned one so I can't say for sure but looking at pictures, having the jacks near the bottom doesn't seem to be a particular problem, at least in vintage Moog slanted walnut cases? Here's some pics borrowed from Dave Brown's site. :tu:

https://modularsynthesis.com/moog/moog1/moog1.htm
moog_cab3_front.jpg
consolepanels.jpg

https://modularsynthesis.com/moog/cpanels/cpanels1.htm
cp2.jpg
cp2_rear.jpg
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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by Flareless »

xerxl wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:42 pm I voted before I saw Rich's mixer and started thinking :-) Wouldn't be a bad idea for me at all to stuff a row under my main case. Temting.

Cheers,

Jurgen
Here's the 1MU sidecar to the mixer with VU meters and 2 additional outputs. Unfortunately it never got built as my customer only had room for the mixer.

YOM.jpg
YOM.jpg (6.57 KiB) Viewed 412 times

While I like to have at least one of every module I sell active in my rig I couldn't justify building a full CP version of the mixer for myself. I have no CP rows in my entire setup. I am, however, thinking of making an 11MU x 1 CP cabinet wrapped in black Tolex to match my existing cases.

I'd put one of these mixers (the full 5MU set) and maybe a few Oakley Classic VCAs and a Multimix on a custom panel. Add a few support modules and it'd be an excellent output boat.

It would sure look really cool!

Hmmmmmm.....
Rich

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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by Eric the Red »

The Euro world seemed to have gone “CP” with the 1-MU modules. At first they seemed kind of silly, now they are almost standard in a lot of peoples racks. It looked like it took about 1-2 years to catch on. The 2 competing formats kind of sucks..

If the CP modules are interesting enough, I’m sure folks will make them work in their system. Maybe make the panels Eurorack sized so a new format/style of case doesn’t need to get made, and people can just use “off the shelf” parts?
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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by ws9848 »

I like the idea but my case doesn’y have a cp row or I’d have some and since I’m done buying 5U :hihi: I probably wont end up with any.
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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by synthetic »

I considered it, because the CP modules under the oscillators on Moog are pretty cool. But I figured I would always end up short on my main row or my CP row, looking for something to fill the space, so I just went the Dotcom route.
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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by Mark11Audio »

... well if anybody would like a little inspiration, I just took delivery of my new system mid Dec 2021... and a 4th Cabinet is in the works with an additional CP row 12U wide... so that will bring my CP row count to 48U... many of the "Multiples" can be swapped out for the Trunk Line's which connects all the cabinets behind the scenes so I have the ability to take a connection from Cab #1 all the way over to Cab #4 without a 10' patch cable... :tu: I think I was the *ONLY* vote at the top... "I have CP Row Modules and Plan to add more..." :lol:
2022-01-13 10.09.23.jpg
2022-01-13 10.09.34.jpg
2022-01-13 10.09.42.jpg
and the whole thing... :mrgreen:
2022-01-11 17.32.31.jpg
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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by KSS »

:tu:
Seems like you've gone past the Buzz, Neil LEM -and Mike in the CM- and moved on to 2001's monolith!<-- Go figure. Kubrick was off by 20 years. ;)
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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by Flareless »

@Mark11Audio - Wow! Your setup is absolutely beautiful :clap:
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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by Mark11Audio »

Flareless wrote: Sat Jan 15, 2022 2:20 am @Mark11Audio - Wow! Your setup is absolutely beautiful :clap:
Thank you, appreciate the compliment... :tu:
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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by robotmakers »

I went the traditional route with mixers in a CP row when putting together this Halloween themed portable instrument. It’s pocket sized compared to Mark11Audio’s, but the same general idea.

P1090308.JPG
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Re: CP format Modules (Revisited)

Post by KSS »

:tu:
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