Replicating vintage digital reverbs on modern hardware (eventide space)

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artilect99
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Replicating vintage digital reverbs on modern hardware (eventide space)

Post by artilect99 » Wed Oct 06, 2021 11:11 am

I've always had a soft spot for the digital reverbs used on early techno albums. I've had a quadraverb on my list for a while, but now that Hainbach has made a video on it I'm guessing the price will shoot up 3-4x. And prices on hardware are already out of control -- I remember pawnshops used to have stacks of these late 80s/early 90s reverbs and multi-fx you couldn't give away, but now anything old and "vintage" automatically commands collector's item prices for some reason. (but I guess the same was true of analog synths once upon a time.)

Anyway this got me wondering about recreating vintage reverbs on something like the eventide space. Any reverb afficionados out there know what exactly replicating the sound of these units would entail (besides bit reduction on the converters I guess.) Would it just be a matter of trimming the frequency range? Now that I'm typing this I'm realizing it might not be possible. Space offers a ton of parameter control but nothing to grunge it up like I want.

what exactly is it that gives e.g. the quadraverb the reverb character it has? I'm guessing it's got a lot to do with the low-bit-rate AD/DA converters and the algo itself. Which I suppose means there's probably not a way to do this on the Space... I was just trying to think of reasons not to buy more hardware. :eek:

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Re: Replicating vintage digital reverbs on modern hardware (eventide space)

Post by nuromantix » Wed Oct 06, 2021 5:36 pm

It's just a great algorithm IMO.
Yes it's a bit lofi but I don't think that's the magical part of it.

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Re: Replicating vintage digital reverbs on modern hardware (eventide space)

Post by Soy Sos » Fri Oct 08, 2021 7:18 am

Pick up Valhalla Vintage Verb.
It's vibe is supposed to be all about the 80's.
Try the demo for free or just buy it for $50 and support a great company.

"ValhallaVintageVerb is a postmodern reverb plugin, inspired by the classic hardware digital reverbs of the 1970s and 1980s."

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Re: Replicating vintage digital reverbs on modern hardware (eventide space)

Post by maxl0rd » Fri Oct 08, 2021 10:21 am

No Eventide reverb will sound like an Alesis reverb because the internal algorithm structures used by Eventide are completely different from those used by Alesis. There are plenty of other guitar pedals out these days that will give you more of that mushy yet grainy vibe you seek but the Space isn't one of them.

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Re: Replicating vintage digital reverbs on modern hardware (eventide space)

Post by artilect99 » Wed Oct 13, 2021 4:32 pm

Hm, yeah, I guess its kinda weird to want an Eventide to sound like a grainy 80s-90s rack verb. I haven't made much headway emulating the quadraverb but came up with some cool presets on the Space anyway.

If I used plugins I'd be all over the Valhalla stuff but when I look at a computer screen it just shuts the musical/creative part of my brain off completely.

Any pedals come specifically to mind? I know there's the Chase Bliss CX1978 thing that's F'n $900... looks awesome, but how much of that price is "vintage mojo" tax? I mean shouldn't those glorious vintage lexicon etc. reverbs from 50 years ago be able to run on basically a $10 MCU these days? 50 years of moore's law...
Last edited by artilect99 on Wed Oct 13, 2021 4:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Replicating vintage digital reverbs on modern hardware (eventide space)

Post by Sir Ruff » Wed Oct 13, 2021 4:43 pm

If you want a quadraverb buy a quadraverb or one of the 5 iterations or 50 sub-variants that all probably sound the same. Prices aren’t going to jump because of one influencer vid.

I recently got a cheap XT, which I imagine/hope is a simplified knobby version of quadraverb… tho haven’t actually plugged it in yet :lol: :roll:

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Re: Replicating vintage digital reverbs on modern hardware (eventide space)

Post by artilect99 » Wed Oct 13, 2021 5:23 pm

Sir Ruff wrote:
Wed Oct 13, 2021 4:43 pm
If you want a quadraverb buy a quadraverb
well, fine, if you're gonna be all logical about it...

like I said I was trying to come up with a reason NOT to spend money on more hardware!

I was half-joking about quadraverb prices skyrocketing but I do feel that the used gear market has become a bit of a farce. Especially now that the 90s are cycling around to "vintage" prices because I was using a lot of that gear in the 90s and it was by and large a HORRIBLE decade for electronic music gear: brittle and thin sounding ADATs, workstation keyboard romplers, flat and lifeless "virtual analogue" synthesis and general MIDI sound modules.

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Re: Replicating vintage digital reverbs on modern hardware (eventide space)

Post by artilect99 » Wed Oct 13, 2021 5:27 pm

btw Ruff did you get it with the power supply included? That seems to be the tricky part regarding the Quadraverbs... and it has that weird multi-pin connector so you can't just buy a generic wall wart... I guess wiring up a custom end plug wouldn't be too difficult provided I can find the PSU specs tho.

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Re: Replicating vintage digital reverbs on modern hardware (eventide space)

Post by Soy Sos » Thu Oct 14, 2021 12:30 am

Honestly, just pick up any cheap 80s pedal or rack unit and you'll have the vibe instantly. I found a weird Peavey guitar pedal that has something like 12 programs on it. No editing, no nothing, sounds amazing. I don't have it with me, but it's a white pedal with pink (!) text. I just tried, but couldn't find anything on reverb or ebay.

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Re: Replicating vintage digital reverbs on modern hardware (eventide space)

Post by gruebleengourd » Thu Oct 14, 2021 11:02 am

Alesis effects were cost effective and had more bang for the buck when new, but they are not really that great sounding (classic or not) and most low cost effects today sound better.

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Re: Replicating vintage digital reverbs on modern hardware (eventide space)

Post by Soy Sos » Thu Oct 14, 2021 11:24 am

gruebleengourd wrote:
Thu Oct 14, 2021 11:02 am
Alesis effects were cost effective and had more bang for the buck when new, but they are not really that great sounding (classic or not) and most low cost effects today sound better.
I don't think it's really a question of better. The OP is seeking a certain sound quality.
Of course new pedals and plugins are cleaner, lusher, deeper, but 80's digi has a certain something.
Whether it be nostalgia or whatever, the heart wants what the heart wants.
Unfiltered Audio has some great old school algos in their BYOME plugin and that shit will take you right there.
I mean this forum is full of all kinds of weirdos seeking all types of specific distortion, tape degradation, delays,
wave folding, FM, granulation, etc etc etc.....
BTW, that Peavey pedal is the SRP-16.
Last edited by Soy Sos on Thu Oct 14, 2021 10:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Replicating vintage digital reverbs on modern hardware (eventide space)

Post by maxl0rd » Thu Oct 14, 2021 5:40 pm

Well, the Quadraverb had a lot of different kinds of programs. Do you like those harsh, metallic short rooms that people used on snares and claps, or the 10 second wall of mud programs? The thing with today's products is they tend to be more focused on one kind of sound. So you need to buy 100 different pedals to get all the different sounds that you could get out of something like a PCM90. Go capitalism!

This forum is full of weirdos all right. Truest statement in this thread so far.

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Re: Replicating vintage digital reverbs on modern hardware (eventide space)

Post by gruebleengourd » Thu Oct 14, 2021 7:43 pm

The thing is, for whatever reason (and it's not to do with them sounding good) the alesis units now sell for as much as say a Yamaha spx990 or rev500, and other many similar vintage units that are a lot "better" and give you plenty of options and can do similar. A PCM90 is only 5 times the typical asking price of a quadraverb. An SPX2000 2x a quadraverb. Still too much money for someone who doesn't want to pay for a quadraverb, but worth saving up a while longer if you are going to buy something.

Anyhow as for the OPs question -- "what exactly is it that gives e.g. the quadraverb the reverb character it has? I'm guessing it's got a lot to do with the low-bit-rate AD/DA converters and the algo itself"

The positives of the quadraverb are 100% due to the decent algorithms for the price. Yamaha stuff can be pretty similar.

You don't have to have the same algorithm to make a good sound. If you wan't "that particular sound" then you might as well just pay for the QV. The better option is however to spend time tweaking what you have to learn how to make it sound a way you like and don't sweat that someone used an alesis on an album you liked.

For something new, certainly a mooer shimverb pro, reverie or some other cheapie that has a variety of verbs including some modulated verbs would fill in ok. The Mr Black reverb pedals and others that use the FV-1 chip (designed by ex-Alesis engineer) are certainly worth a listen, but are more expensive.
Last edited by gruebleengourd on Fri Oct 15, 2021 2:45 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Replicating vintage digital reverbs on modern hardware (eventide space)

Post by Sir Ruff » Fri Oct 15, 2021 9:42 am

artilect99 wrote:
Wed Oct 13, 2021 5:27 pm
btw Ruff did you get it with the power supply included? That seems to be the tricky part regarding the Quadraverbs... and it has that weird multi-pin connector so you can't just buy a generic wall wart... I guess wiring up a custom end plug wouldn't be too difficult provided I can find the PSU specs tho.
Power is actually hardwired so no issue there. Also it looks like the XT was actually the first Alesis product? huh... so a precursor rather than derivative of Quadra/midiverb, et al. Will provide some grainy verbs no doubt... (eventually I will find out once I plug in, LOL)

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Re: Replicating vintage digital reverbs on modern hardware (eventide space)

Post by Technologear? » Mon Oct 18, 2021 5:01 am

Alexander and Meris do pedals inspired by older reverb algos. Not cheap but good gear. Whenever I use a modern quality pedal, I reconsider my rack effects. Knobs are good and promote moving away from set n forget or preset based rack units that are all over others records.

While you save for pedals or a QV, try a very light drive effect either pre or post your current reverb. Grunge it from a different source.

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Re: Replicating vintage digital reverbs on modern hardware (eventide space)

Post by Soy Sos » Mon Oct 18, 2021 1:07 pm

Great point about saturation/drive/distortion (Technologear?) I do that a lot in Ableton. Another thing I love doing on a console with a reverb used with an aux and returned to a channel, is to feed it back to itself just a little bit. Use a shorter reverb and extend with just a little self feedback. Obviously too much will send it into self oscillation, but there's some lovely tones to be found just before that point.

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