FH-2 internal clock reset

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psirca
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FH-2 internal clock reset

Post by psirca » Wed Jun 09, 2021 1:09 pm

Hello,

I am thinking of using FH-2 as my master clock, and as I currently have problems keeping my SL MK iii in phase with analog clock (QuBit Rhythm + Ladik M-330 Clock to MIDI), I was hoping I'd find a clock with reset input, so that the downstream SL MK iii could reset the clock every couple of measures to prevent SL MK iii drifting out of phase.

So the question is - does FH-2 support a Clock reset ? I cannot find anything about it in the manual ..

Obviously the other option would be to have SL MK iii being the clock source, but not sure how well that would work if I would to then drive other EuroRack gear on FH-2 Clock out ..

Many thanks,
Peter

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os
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Re: FH-2 internal clock reset

Post by os » Wed Jun 09, 2021 1:57 pm

Having the SL as the clock source ought to work fine.

It should also work fine following a MIDI clock. Following a MIDI clock is not hard. If the SL is drifting out, I would be suspicious of the things generating the clock - or maybe the SL just doesn't follow clock well. In which case, having it as the leader would be worth trying.

psirca
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Re: FH-2 internal clock reset

Post by psirca » Thu Jun 10, 2021 7:37 am

From my tests it seems that SL is simply not following the clock well. I have been feeding the same clock via Clock to MIDI to SL MK iii and as well to Pittsburg Modular MIDI3, doing the arp. While MIDI3 kept in sync with the QuBit Rhythm, SL MK iii's arp was drifting wildly.
So the options I have are:
- trying the reset Analog Clock from SL MK iii Clock out - but that imits my choice of the Clock to the rare ones with Reset input
- putting SL MK iii as the leader - and losing the BPM control knob for easy tempo changes
- using SL MK iii only as a MIDI controller and getting a modular sequencer

So back to my original question - FH-2 does not have the Clock Reset In then ?

psirca
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Re: FH-2 internal clock reset

Post by psirca » Thu Jun 10, 2021 7:37 am

psirca wrote:
Thu Jun 10, 2021 7:37 am
From my tests it seems that SL is simply not following the clock well. I have been feeding the same clock via Clock to MIDI to SL MK iii and as well to Pittsburg Modular MIDI3, doing the arp. While MIDI3 kept in sync with the QuBit Rhythm, SL MK iii's arp was drifting wildly.
So the options I have are:
- trying the reset Analog Clock from SL MK iii Clock out - but that imits my choice of the Clock to the rare ones with Reset input
- putting SL MK iii as the leader - and losing the direct BPM control knob for easy tempo changes
- using SL MK iii only as a MIDI controller and getting a modular sequencer

So back to my original question - FH-2 does not have the Clock Reset In then ?

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os
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Re: FH-2 internal clock reset

Post by os » Thu Jun 10, 2021 7:41 am

I'm not sure what you mean by a 'clock reset', in the context of MIDI.

psirca
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Re: FH-2 internal clock reset

Post by psirca » Thu Jun 10, 2021 7:45 am

My assumption is that FH-2's internal clock is analog, and MIDI clock is feeding from it.

So my thinking is if I could reset this internal clock every couple of bars by the output from SL MK iii, I could keep the whole thing in phase, at a price of a small wobble now and then ?

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Re: FH-2 internal clock reset

Post by os » Thu Jun 10, 2021 8:19 am

That's not really how it works.

Have you talked to Novation? It sounds like the SL is simply bugged.

psirca
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Re: FH-2 internal clock reset

Post by psirca » Thu Jun 10, 2021 8:24 am

Is there anywhere I can read up on how FH-2 clocking works ?
If nothing else I assume FH-2 takes an external analog clock in ?

As for Novation, I have been putting off contacting them about this, as it involves external hardware and they're likely to point the finger at that first.
Also if such a basic thing on a mass product has not been fixed in several years, I doubt my chances of achieveing something. Will still do it, because some of the support guys are very consentious, not all mind you ..

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os
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Re: FH-2 internal clock reset

Post by os » Thu Jun 10, 2021 8:36 am

The FH-2 can generate an internal clock, follow an analogue clock, or follow a MIDI clock.

Internally it's essentially working at MIDI clock rate (24ppqn), so there's a one-to-one correspondence between the internal clock and an incoming or outgoing MIDI clock.

If the analogue clock is also at 24ppqn, then everything is completely locked tight.

You should always report bugs. You may think companies are unlikely to fix bugs, but if you don't report it, you can be 100% certain they won't fix it, because they don't know about it.

psirca
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Re: FH-2 internal clock reset

Post by psirca » Thu Jun 10, 2021 10:09 am

os wrote:
Thu Jun 10, 2021 8:36 am
You should always report bugs. You may think companies are unlikely to fix bugs, but if you don't report it, you can be 100% certain they won't fix it, because they don't know about it.
I know, but having to fix bugs in my day job I am also aware that you need a good reproducible case. So far my setup is too complex, I have just got an LFO and will repeat all my tests by using that as a clock instead of the QuBit Rhythm. And instead of using MIDI3 arp as a base tempo, I'll simply take an LFO output into a clock divider and directly into drums. So I'll have divided LFO pulses on one side and the SL MK ii arp on another. If I get the drift, I'll try driving the drums from Clock to MIDI converter and if the drift stays, I think I have a rock solid case.

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Re: FH-2 internal clock reset

Post by psirca » Thu Jun 10, 2021 3:41 pm

Spent a couple of hours noodling with LFO as clock source as described above (LFO into Clock to MIDI and through divider directly into drums) and I am not getting any significant drifting on SL MKiii seq or arp. Of course I can get out of phase by starting the sequencer/transport on the offbeat, but whatever phase it starts in, it seems to keep it. Arps on SL MK iii still run if the transport is stopped, not sure what phase they're observing then, but I shall attempt to avoid such usage.

However when I tried switching the clock source from LFO to QuBit Rhythm Clock out, immediately there was wobblines, serious wobblines, I could hear the rhythm slowing down and picking up again. Funny thing is that QuBit Rhythm drums output always seemed solid, but it looks like the clock out is anything but. And when I tried running QuBit Rhythm clock based drums and QuBit Rhythm drums output side by side, they do not seem to match at all. I'll spend some more time on this to make absolutely sure this all holds water, but so far it looks like QuBIt Rhythm will have to go, and it looks very probable that I'll also sell M-330 Clock to Midi and replace it all with FH-2.

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Re: FH-2 internal clock reset

Post by psirca » Sun Jun 13, 2021 3:25 pm

Hello, another FH-2 question, manual states:
"Arp Rate The rate of the arpeggiator, in terms of 24ppqn clocks. The special value '0' means
that the arpeggiator advances every time the FH-2 receives an external clock pulse.
(This is useful in order to create irregular arpeggiation rhythms.) "

So can I have an internal clock running and still use an external clock only to advance arp as needed ?

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Re: FH-2 internal clock reset

Post by os » Mon Jun 14, 2021 2:46 am

Yes.

psirca
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Re: FH-2 internal clock reset

Post by psirca » Mon Jun 14, 2021 4:29 am

Thanks and yippie ! That is a very powerful feature.

So my plan is to run FH-2 internal clock as my master clock (encoder changing the BPM), send it to MIDI Out so that SL MKiii will hopefully sync to it without problems and then take a div/mult-ed clock out signal from FH-2, run it through some additional processing and bring it back into X as an external clock, in order to advance the arps that have Arp rate set to "0". And at the same time I may have some other arps that have Arp Rate directly related to the master clock.

If you can spot a problem in the above, pls let me know ..

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