Korg Wavestate

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GGW
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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by GGW » Mon Sep 28, 2020 6:01 pm

Does anyone have this that had a Wavestation before? I loved the Wavestation sound and the Wavestate seems to sound even better, but I was so frustrated with the Wavestation programming in every sense that I sold it and promised myself never again. As I'm reading the negatives with programming this new synth, I'm trying to determine if it is clunky, or Wavestation style obstructive. Any insights in this regard?

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by pricklyrobot » Sat Oct 03, 2020 12:05 pm

Can’t comment on the Wavestate, as I’ve not tried it yet, but if you’re an iPad/app person, iWavestation sounds really good and has a very usable interface.
It can still be a little overwhelming, just due to the sheer volume of parameters available to edit. But they’re all visually accessible and fairly intuitive to adjust.
Just need to find a MIDI controller with a decent joystick to take full advantage...;)

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by th0mas » Sat Oct 03, 2020 12:29 pm

pricklyrobot wrote:
Sat Oct 03, 2020 12:05 pm
iWavestation sounds really good and has a very usable interface.
I tried iWavestation before caving and getting the wavestate and I found the UI to be quite buggy and hard to dial in simple things like wave transitions. I would tap and drag my finger and the UI would respond as if I pulled it in the opposite direction to what I was doing. Felt like an unnatural port of the desktop VST

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by pricklyrobot » Sat Oct 03, 2020 1:22 pm

^ fair points. I have noticed you have to be zoomed in to make certain wave adjustments.

To me it didn’t seem any worse than iOS interfaces generally, where it frequently takes some trial and error to get the hang of control movements.

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by Christopher W. » Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:09 pm

GGW wrote:
Mon Sep 28, 2020 6:01 pm
Does anyone have this that had a Wavestation before? I loved the Wavestation sound and the Wavestate seems to sound even better, but I was so frustrated with the Wavestation programming in every sense that I sold it and promised myself never again. As I'm reading the negatives with programming this new synth, I'm trying to determine if it is clunky, or Wavestation style obstructive. Any insights in this regard?
Totally, utterly different interfaces. The method of programming sequences is a very divergent and that's reflected in the way it's laid out. Because lanes for pitch, wave, duration, etc are all running parallel and with available elements of randomness you don't just add steps like beads on a string.

I was never that put off by the original WS interface (back in the day 2x16 character displays were still very much the norm and the WS display was a relative pleasure to use by comparison) so I can't say whether you'd find this new one obstructive.

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by GGW » Thu Oct 15, 2020 2:13 pm

Christopher Winkels wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:09 pm
Totally, utterly different interfaces. .......(snip)
Thanks for your insight. I enjoy programming my own sounds and I was also comfortable with the limited displays of the time. I just remember the Wavestation as a particular challenge. There were three layers, wavetables, patches, and performances; that are all created independently and then linked at a higher level. Some edits were immediate but others had to be saved. There was a way to go up a layer without any warning that all edits at the present layer were going to be lost without a manual save. I like your metaphor of threading beads on a string.

I really like the types of sounds I hear in the demos for the Wavestate, and it does seem to be a very different architecture and interface.

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by smurf » Mon Nov 23, 2020 9:56 am

Hi - seems like communication via usb for updating firmware etc is broken with windows 10 2004.

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by Zymos » Mon Nov 23, 2020 10:53 am

It is. Korg has been working on a fix.

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by smurf » Mon Nov 23, 2020 11:13 am

Yea - I can see a post about it from July! Got to say this is a first. Can't update the firmware on a new device - incredible.

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by Zymos » Mon Nov 23, 2020 11:33 am

It’s a stupid situation, that’s for sure. Dan from Korg said over on Gearslutz a week or so ago that it should be resolved “very soon”, FWIW.

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by smurf » Tue Nov 24, 2020 4:33 am

Maybe they can configure the wavestate so that it doesn't use the strange network protocol. The instructions are INSANE for a device with usb in 2020. How did they get into this mess? Such a shame a great synth knobbled in this way. On the plus side it is a great synth BUT THEY NEED TO SORT THIS OUT.

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by Kattefjaes » Tue Nov 24, 2020 5:27 am

smurf wrote:
Mon Nov 23, 2020 9:56 am
Hi - seems like communication via usb for updating firmware etc is broken with windows 10 2004.
I suppose it makes a change from stuff not working yet again due to MacOS updates. Still though, not testing on Windows might be even more impressive.
Nelson Baboon wrote:
Sun Sep 27, 2020 5:50 pm
to me, there is a strong, inherent contradiction in the design. On the one hand, with the incredible modulation routings, obviously was thought of by the 'modulation designer' as an experimental machine. But the 'timbral designer' thought, 'gee, people will get so confused if they can design their own sounds from scratch', and left it, inexplicably to my mind, as a preset sample only machine. I still haven't decided whether i want to work with this, since on the one hand, for me, it means continually fighting with the design. On the other hand, there is so much in there.
This is what I came here for, whether there had finally been a major rethink, if there was a librarian tool to let you import your own stuff so you can throw in your own waveforms/samples. Weird UI aside, if this had been an option, it would have been an appealing experimental sound design instrument. I loved the Wavestation at the time. When this was announced, the idea of a Wavestation-alike for the modern age sounded very attractive, because of course you'd be able to add your own high-quality samples, right?
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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by musicman3000 » Sat Nov 28, 2020 10:58 am

I found this thread trying to figure out the tempo setting on the synth. Thanks for that info.

I have a question: What was the original Wavestate predominantly used for? I can see the appeal of its sequencing and programming options as a performance based instrument but did people also use it in the studio? Especially now, are there any benefits of using its successor as a studio device for layering, manipulation and sequencing samples over a DAW or Falcon? I'm not being cynical, just inexperienced and curious. I bought mine because I wanted a poly and I really like the sound, so I thought I can use it in the very least as a rompler that can layer sounds. But now I can't shake the feeling I bought a 650€ VST with a custom midi interface (pertaining I don't use its specifically unique features as a wavestate sequencer or use it as a performance instrument with preprogrammed progressions).

Also besides being very light and plasticy, the USB port doesn't seem to be properly isolated, at least I get a lot of interference when I want to use usb midi + audio outs.

Anyway, I bought this with a DigiTakt as my first real OTB venture and I really enjoy it. It's a great synth and unique offering. Functionally, I can use it's sounds as a sonically complex starting point for a track, similar to cutting up a sample or use simpler sounds for a chord track.

edit: sorry if my question is stupid, just when I look at the 6 wseq lanes, I ask myself, do I really want to do this on that device over a DAW? I'm gonna explore it in the next months either way and see whats up. But maybe there's something obvious I'm missing!

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by pmboos » Sat Nov 28, 2020 1:14 pm

musicman3000 wrote:
Sat Nov 28, 2020 10:58 am
I found this thread trying to figure out the tempo setting on the synth. Thanks for that info.

I have a question: What was the original Wavestate predominantly used for? I can see the appeal of its sequencing and programming options as a performance based instrument but did people also use it in the studio? Especially now, are there any benefits of using its successor as a studio device for layering, manipulation and sequencing samples over a DAW or Falcon? I'm not being cynical, just inexperienced and curious. I bought mine because I wanted a poly and I really like the sound, so I thought I can use it in the very least as a rompler that can layer sounds. But now I can't shake the feeling I bought a 650€ VST with a custom midi interface (pertaining I don't use its specifically unique features as a wavestate sequencer or use it as a performance instrument with preprogrammed progressions).

Also besides being very light and plasticy, the USB port doesn't seem to be properly isolated, at least I get a lot of interference when I want to use usb midi + audio outs.

Anyway, I bought this with a DigiTakt as my first real OTB venture and I really enjoy it. It's a great synth and unique offering. Functionally, I can use it's sounds as a sonically complex starting point for a track, similar to cutting up a sample or use simpler sounds for a chord track.

edit: sorry if my question is stupid, just when I look at the 6 wseq lanes, I ask myself, do I really want to do this on that device over a DAW? I'm gonna explore it in the next months either way and see whats up. But maybe there's something obvious I'm missing!
As someone who was interested in the Wavestation when it came out back in the day and now am interested in the WaveState, I'll take a first crack and answering your question.

This is quite a bit more advanced than the original Wavestation. Here is the VSE entry about it: http://www.vintagesynth.com/korg/wavestation.php

The new one retains the sequencing capability as well as the vector synthesis, but now you have many more 5 more lanes for modifying the sound. And it looks like many other options as well. I would imagine this makes programming even more complicated, but I suspect the results are fantastic. You also get oodles more effects. That's what I get. The biggest downside is from a keyboard standpoint, 37 keys vs the original's 61. For this type of instrument not sure it matters a ton.
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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by TheRosskonian » Sun Nov 29, 2020 3:39 pm

musicman3000 wrote:
Sat Nov 28, 2020 10:58 am
I'm not being cynical, just inexperienced and curious. I bought mine because I wanted a poly and I really like the sound, so I thought I can use it in the very least as a rompler that can layer sounds. But now I can't shake the feeling I bought a 650€ VST with a custom midi interface (pertaining I don't use its specifically unique features as a wavestate sequencer or use it as a performance instrument with preprogrammed progressions).
edit: sorry if my question is stupid, just when I look at the 6 wseq lanes, I ask myself, do I really want to do this on that device over a DAW? I'm gonna explore it in the next months either way and see whats up. But maybe there's something obvious I'm missing!
I can really relate to this feeling and especially the question: "do I really want to do this on that device over a DAW?" I have had the Wavestate long enough to learn how to navigate the menus and system, but I haven't been able to figure out how to create a patch that really justifies itself. I assume a big part of this is simply that it's a different way to create sounds than I am used it, mainly the wave sequencing sections. However, all the individual components sound good (the build-in sounds/samples, FX, etc). Along with the ability to have four layers and enough envelopes and LFOs make me want to keep it.

A few other initial thoughts on the Wavestate (keep in mind it's still relatively new to me):

Keys, as always, are a subjective thing. I don't find them as bad as this thread made it sound, I'd probably put them on par with the Minilogue's keys, although for reference, it's been 3 months between playing a Minilogue and the Wavestate. BUT, they are full size, and this is very much welcomed over the alternative of minikeys.

I actually really like the form factor. This goes in hand with the keys being full size. It's small and light enough to sit in a stand above an 88 key midi controller, but the keybed means I can take it around to somewhere else and use it all by itself without feeling too cramped on a mini-keybed.

A hold button or a traditional sequencer that sits over all the layers really feels missing from it. Using the Wavestate in a bigger setup, I have to use something to trigger it's own sequencer. Between a sustain pedal, a "key dog" (basically a heavy object shaped to hold down a key), and external sequencers, I have this covered, but it feels like an odd omission given how useful it is on the Wavestate.

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by blipson » Sun Nov 29, 2020 6:25 pm

TheRosskonian wrote:
Sun Nov 29, 2020 3:39 pm
A hold button or a traditional sequencer that sits over all the layers really feels missing from it. Using the Wavestate in a bigger setup, I have to use something to trigger it's own sequencer. Between a sustain pedal, a "key dog" (basically a heavy object shaped to hold down a key), and external sequencers, I have this covered, but it feels like an odd omission given how useful it is on the Wavestate.
I just got mine and before learning how to use the interface in even the most basic ways, I quickly learned to go to each layer in a patch to enable arpeggio latch to get a hold function. It's truly an unexpected thing to have to do. What do you use for a "key dog"?

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by TheRosskonian » Sun Nov 29, 2020 11:48 pm

blipson wrote:
Sun Nov 29, 2020 6:25 pm
TheRosskonian wrote:
Sun Nov 29, 2020 3:39 pm
A hold button or a traditional sequencer that sits over all the layers really feels missing from it. Using the Wavestate in a bigger setup, I have to use something to trigger it's own sequencer. Between a sustain pedal, a "key dog" (basically a heavy object shaped to hold down a key), and external sequencers, I have this covered, but it feels like an odd omission given how useful it is on the Wavestate.
I just got mine and before learning how to use the interface in even the most basic ways, I quickly learned to go to each layer in a patch to enable arpeggio latch to get a hold function. It's truly an unexpected thing to have to do. What do you use for a "key dog"?
There is also a hold function in the performance menu on the bottom of the fifth page, but it's unwieldy enough that I wouldn't consider using it in any sort of performance or live setting. A dedicated button would have made so much more sense.

I got the key dog from KVGear: https://kvgear.com/products/key-dog

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by blipson » Mon Nov 30, 2020 12:29 am

Thanks, I just ordered four of those dogs. That hold function is next to useless. I mean, you have to enable hold in each layer separately, then disable in each layer separately when you want to hit a different note. They need to make a performance-oriented way (some sort of clever button combo) to switch hold on and off for all layers at the same time.

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by musicman3000 » Mon Nov 30, 2020 5:45 pm

Thanks for the replys guys!

About the latch function: if this is surfaced as a switch in the menues, maybe you can program a macro function activate/deactivate hold for all layers at the same time?

I did have fun with the sounds in it so far but still haven't gotten in programming lanes.

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by Zymos » Sat Dec 05, 2020 4:02 pm

Looks like updating/communication with Win 10 is working now.

Copied this from a post on Gearslutz:


“ Windows 10 RNDIS problem is fixed!
The USB RNDIS driver problem on Windows 10 is fixed!

You need to update your Windows to Windows 10, Version 20H2, build 19042.662. To do this, you must:
Use Windows Update to upgrade to Windows 10 version 20H2
Install KB4586853

KB4586853 is a PREVIEW release, which means it has not been fully tested, so be careful. However, it does work. It can be downloaded and installed here:
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/...date-kb4586853

You may also be able to get it through Windows Update.

Once it is installed and your PC rebooted, you need to reinstall the RNDIS driver as you did the first time. You can see instructions here:

https://www.sweetwater.com/sweetcare...-instructions/

I can confirm that once you do this, the Wavestate librarian can once again talk to the Wavestate!”

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by th0mas » Sun Dec 20, 2020 9:57 am

I traded my wavestate for a sherman filterbank.

Very potent synth, I just prefer gear I can build a patch on while jamming. To get the most out of the wavestate and not a random result I had to sit down with only it and build patches in a separate session. I just don't have time for that right now.

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by anselmi » Sun Dec 20, 2020 10:42 am

th0mas wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 9:57 am
I traded my wavestate for a sherman filterbank.

Very potent synth, I just prefer gear I can build a patch on while jamming. To get the most out of the wavestate and not a random result I had to sit down with only it and build patches in a separate session. I just don't have time for that right now.
well, I think you won a lot in this trade...the Sherman is a timeless classic, with a very solid construction and loads of character

and I´m with you about the wavestate, it needs the kind of workflow that I could do like 20 years ago...I even now use my menu-driven ROMplers as mere sample-playback devices with external filters and fx...can´t stand to stay so many time going back and forth to modify a single parameter in a little display.
Last edited by anselmi on Mon Dec 21, 2020 2:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by Blairio » Mon Dec 21, 2020 12:30 pm

I like the wavestate. A friend of mine bought one a few months back and was kind enough to let me use it for a couple of weeks.

But I prefered the Wavestation EX I had in the early 90's. There is such a thing as too much choice ( the tyranny of choice!), and that is how I felt about the Wavestate. So many modulation channels, plys gigabytes of waveform samples...

However I am past 60, and younger minds will doubtless realise the full potential of the Wavestate.

What I would suggest is that if someone was set on a Wavestate, but funds would only stretch to a 2nd hand Wavestation, they would not be disappointed.

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by anselmi » Wed Jan 20, 2021 3:14 am

new Wavestate SE
they should use the extra panel space to develop the UI instead of leave this large blanks
wavestate-SE_slant.png

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Re: Korg Wavestate

Post by pmboos » Wed Jan 20, 2021 8:42 am

Nice! I don't mind a bit of flat space, I could put my Typhon on it, or the Anyma Phi I backed, or a Volca or two... (or maybe even a small midi controller)
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