Moog Subsequent 37

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Truckfumes
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Post by Truckfumes » Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:17 pm

MARK27 wrote:I don't think it's a firmware update.

I think they are talking about physically replacing older parts with newer ones.
"Older" parts? You mean like 2-3 year old parts?
Older parts. Right.
In any case that emphasizes my point further.
But if you never liked the synth to begin with, why are you even paying attention?
Hmnn.. why would I be paying attention?
1. I was in the market for a synth like that and actually purchased it.
2. Quickly realizing the synth was Sub Par 37 at least; if not just a complete hurried hack job, I was interested in getting other's opinions on the matter to see if my feelings were in the ballpark. Other folks on this forum and on the street shared my views.(concerning specific issues)
3. I'm interested in Moog products.
4. I'm interested in other people's opinions of Moog products.
5. I got the news about the Sub 37 being discontinued and it's replacement with the Subsequent. This concretely confirmed my feelings about the synth.
6. Then I saw this thread about the Sub Series and wanted to read up and maybe comment further on this matter. Seeing as how I had direct experiences with the synth.

I don't know, does that answer your question about why I would be paying attention?
Is it ok with you if I pay attention to things that interest me?
The Sub 37 was a hunk of junk. Period.
That's why it was discontinued and replaced.
That's why they're putting out replacement parts and cute little notices about how you should keep enjoying it.
Keep enjoying it. It has keys that make noises and big filter knob that you can turn.
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Post by gentle_attack » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:25 pm

This thread is pretty wild. I thought people loved the Sub37? I thought it was awesome when I got to noodle with it at GC a few months ago... Feature-wise this thing CRUSHES the SP and LP, even without the Subsequent features. I guess the sub group of synth people who think Voyagers sound bad must really hate the Sub37 because it's too widely available, and not expensive enough?

Was there something wrond with the Amp or Amp envelope that can magically be fixed? If there was a big issue wouldn't we all have heard about it?

I'm REALLY far from a Moog apologist (fucking 104-m without clock out, LFO out, clock in, non-midi subdivisions, tap couldn't be LFO and TIME at the same time)... that thing LACKED for the pricetag... I'll most certainly roast'em, where roast is due... but I do not follow on this one.
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Post by chvad » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:59 pm

Lots of synths are discontinued. Lots of everything is. My TV is. It still works fine. Most of my pedals are. Oh no.. they must suck now. Sub37 is a fine synth. People had input. Moog listened and complied. Most companies don't. If you cant make a solid track or sound with the sub37 that's on you. The gear is fine. Or get a little phatty.. oh wait. Discontinued. Must suck. Oh wait... Grab a Voyager old school. Nope. It's gotta suck. Blah blah blah.

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Post by haternob » Fri Sep 08, 2017 1:26 am

I can understand the frustration of those who feel the Sub37 should have been like the subsequent in the first place. The thing is, most companies in this position would not offer an upgrade option, they'd just release a mk2. At least it looks like Moog are going to give original Sub37 owners the opportunity to upgrade their unit. I'm interested to learn how much the upgrade costs. If it's equal to or less than the difference in price between the original and subsequent then I don't think you can ask for much more than that.

PS. I should have thanked Mikey3kg for the heads up on the upgrade announcement! Oops! :doh:

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Post by Truckfumes » Fri Sep 08, 2017 6:07 am

haternob wrote:I can understand the frustration of those who feel the Sub37 should have been like the subsequent in the first place. The thing is, most companies in this position would not offer an upgrade option, they'd just release a mk2. At least it looks like Moog are going to give original Sub37 owners the opportunity to upgrade their unit. I'm interested to learn how much the upgrade costs. If it's equal to or less than the difference in price between the original and subsequent then I don't think you can ask for much more than that.
Yeah that sounds reasonable. For those who want it. Obviously many people are completely satisfied with their 37s.
Plus I heard that there were improvements made through firmware updates.
This focused on modulation calibration among other things if I recall correctly.

I just got a good chuckle reading that notice above from Moog.
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Post by Oblivion » Mon Sep 11, 2017 9:57 pm

Have a Sub 37. Played with a silver Subsequent at KnobCon. I didn't hear enough in the filter drive to make me want to upgrade. Keybed, I GUESS was a little better? Would really have to play them side-by-side for me to notice.

I think there were 6 assignable CVs outs on the right-hand panel. If there's a way to upgrade my Sub for THAT? I'm in. Not going to hold my breath, though. Nor lose sleep over it.
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Post by Mikeyg3k » Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:47 am

Truckfumes wrote: I had my Sub 37 for about a month or two when it first came out.
.
Hey that could be your problem - maybe if you spent some more quality time with it you'd realize how cool it is. It challenges me constantly to learn more sound design but always delivers. But to each his own, I guess it's all a matter of what moves you personally. Did you get something cool instead?

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Post by Truckfumes » Wed Sep 13, 2017 6:03 am

Mikeyg3k wrote:
Truckfumes wrote: I had my Sub 37 for about a month or two when it first came out.
.
Hey that could be your problem - maybe if you spent some more quality time with it you'd realize how cool it is. It challenges me constantly to learn more sound design but always delivers. But to each his own, I guess it's all a matter of what moves you personally. Did you get something cool instead?
Ehnnn, maybe I'll buy the Subsequent 37 and try that out for awhile.
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Post by Mikeyg3k » Wed Sep 13, 2017 12:22 pm

Truckfumes wrote:
Mikeyg3k wrote:
Truckfumes wrote: I had my Sub 37 for about a month or two when it first came out.
.
Hey that could be your problem - maybe if you spent some more quality time with it you'd realize how cool it is. It challenges me constantly to learn more sound design but always delivers. But to each his own, I guess it's all a matter of what moves you personally. Did you get something cool instead?
Ehnnn, maybe I'll buy the Subsequent 37 and try that out for awhile.
Message me here if You do, I've got a rather awesome sound set i've been amassing as well as some really good tutorial videos

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Post by MARK27 » Wed Sep 13, 2017 1:13 pm

Truckfumes wrote:I don't know, does that answer your question about why I would be paying attention?
Is it ok with you if I pay attention to things that interest me?
The Sub 37 was a hunk of junk. Period.
That's why it was discontinued and replaced.
Wow.

Just...

Wow.

:nutter:

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Post by Truckfumes » Wed Sep 13, 2017 7:13 pm

MARK27 wrote:
Truckfumes wrote:I don't know, does that answer your question about why I would be paying attention?
Is it ok with you if I pay attention to things that interest me?
The Sub 37 was a hunk of junk. Period.
That's why it was discontinued and replaced.
Wow.

Just...

Wow.

:nutter:
So I gather from your other post that you'll be getting the replacement parts?
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Post by GuyaGuy » Thu Oct 05, 2017 11:27 pm

I upgraded my "hunk of junk" to the CV version last week. Glad I did. Having the CV outs make it even more of a beast. I have the outs hooked up to a patchbay so I can route them to Euro, Dominion 1, Foogers, etc. A smidge of menu work to re-assign the CV source if needed but not a huge biggie. Only thing I'm not big on is the combination of silver and grey; was expecting more of a Macbook sort of thing. But the face text is more legible!

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Moog subsequent 37 issue

Post by Mick3950 » Sat Oct 14, 2017 8:38 am

Recently purchased this fantastic synth,absolutely amazing,had it approx 6 weeks,turned it on no sound either on the main volume or headphone,everything else was working fine,it has now gone for under warranty repair,as any one else got this problem or is it just a one off,

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re Moog Sub37 CV issue

Post by Pav » Thu Oct 26, 2017 12:16 pm

Had my Sub37CV edition for less than a month and the led switch to latch the arp has gone, though the latch still works and lots of sound out.

Im told i have to return it under warranty to the shop (UK Poole) ..and the Moog get repaired in London. Just for an led I ask ? Yup answer. Can you loan me one whilst its away? Nope answer. What if each led fails one at a time ? .. Ill never get to play it I plea. ... answer ..lets hope it doesnt.

Meanwhile I have a question / heads up... The CV Outs are set to "default"s eg CVOut1 keyCV , CVOUt2 something else etc.
The keyboard CV has a default -5v to +5v setting ... which i have no kit supporting to my knowledge ..0-10v 1v per octave was what I expected.

Yes ..it is configurable to what i want - but .. so far i have only discovered you can do it on a preset by preset basis .... and there are a lot of presets.

Has anyone found a way to globally set the default key cv range ?
the software editor i downloaded hadnt been updfated from Tribute to SubSequent CV ..ill keep checking to see if it does.

Whilst i didnt have Sub37 prior to CV edition ..The keyboard appears far suprior to some Voyager ones i saw at shows a few years back.
rgds Pav

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Post by lumena » Sun Feb 25, 2018 11:13 am

Some days I teeter on the brink of selling the Moog. I found myself dreaming of a Lyra 8 and thought is that really a true thing. There is often so much buzz about new synths I forget how much I can do with what I have.
So I decided to approach the Moog differently.

[video][/video]

Guess it's staying for a while longer. All on take reverb from Ableton.

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My 1st Post ... Sub37 / Subsequent37 keybed comparison

Post by The Aurium » Tue Mar 27, 2018 6:56 pm

Hi everyone - well, I just bought the Subsequent37CV so there's a few things I can say if no-one has already...

I did an A/B comparison: all personal perception & taste obviously but here' some experiences..

Keybed - Sub37 is springier with noticably more resistance in black keys: Subsequent is lighter, clickier (but not unpleasant - little louder than Prophet6 keys & a little more clicky) with equal resistance in the black keys (which are slightly more square on the front-top edge).

Keybed - yes the subsequent is slightly yellow or faded in colour! Not as white as the Sub37. It's after touch grades very nicely and is the best I've ever tried.

Pots - most wobble very very slightly on both old & new versions - seem to be just the way they're made these days (surface mounted but cheaper to repair??)

Also - with a mic amp, a mic can input to Audio In & you have a Corey Henry style vocoder .... I guess you realise that though :)

Question is ... do I still sell my original mint TB-303 to pay for it or start letting them talk to each other ???!?!

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Re: My 1st Post ... Sub37 / Subsequent37 keybed comparison

Post by Mikeyg3k » Sun Apr 01, 2018 12:36 am

The Aurium wrote:
Also - with a mic amp, a mic can input to Audio In & you have a Corey Henry style vocoder .... I guess you realise that though :)
!
Any videos of this I'd love to see how that works!

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Post by Josef_K » Mon Jul 16, 2018 9:27 am

This synth sure seems interesting. I've been toying with the idea of replacing my trusty LP tribute edition since the Yamaha CS-5 made me realise I don't care about presets but absolutely love hands on control. Also I need a controller with a good keyboard for my eurorack and as many knobs/switches as possible to control Softube Modular. The new Arturia Keylab 2 has got the keybed but the Subsequent 37 beats it with the layout and sheer amount of knobs.

I tried it out in a store today and the sound was just a tiny bit "cold" and "digital" when fully opening up the filter. I think I can live with that, tweaking the knobs feels magical compared to the LP and the modulation capabilities are massive in comparison. I don't think there is a better unit to fit my needs :)

EDIT: Or maybe there is a better unit. I've completely overlooked the cheaper and more analog Grandmother (Sub 37 has digital envelopes and lfo:s apparently). It has five less keys but a Fatar keyboard! Maybe this is the controller I've been looking for, although the single adsr might feel a bit meh when performing live. Nothing that can't be solved with a doepfer mini case though :)

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How to set bpm for Moog Subsequent 37 arp from Ableton

Post by brittonashford » Wed Sep 26, 2018 8:24 pm

Hello out there,

This is my first post and I'm new to MIDI/synth, so please excuse my ignorance.

I am trying to record a track in Ableton Live 10 with synth (audio), bass (audio), and drums (MIDI). The problem I have run into is that my Subsequent 37 has a very imprecise bpm setting for the arpeggiator, which is basically the most important part of this tune. This makes it hard to keep it on rhythm with the rest of the parts which are at 128 bpm.

I know the Subsequent 37 has MIDI and MIDI-via-USB capabilities, but I don't know how to set this up. The manual isn't very helpful to this end, as it just provides a brief description of the MIDI menu parameters. I went to Moog's website and downloaded the "MIDI USB" driver, thinking that once this was installed, my synth would show up in Ableton like my Push 2 does, or perhaps as an "External Instrument". Unfortunately, that was not the case.

Can anyone explain to me what I need to do to set the Moog's Arp bpm via MIDI with my DAW?

If it matters, I'm running Windows 10 on a PC.

Thanks in advance!

--brittonashford

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Re: How to set bpm for Moog Subsequent 37 arp from Ableton

Post by GuyaGuy » Wed Sep 26, 2018 9:14 pm

brittonashford wrote:Hello out there,

This is my first post and I'm new to MIDI/synth, so please excuse my ignorance.

I am trying to record a track in Ableton Live 10 with synth (audio), bass (audio), and drums (MIDI). The problem I have run into is that my Subsequent 37 has a very imprecise bpm setting for the arpeggiator, which is basically the most important part of this tune. This makes it hard to keep it on rhythm with the rest of the parts which are at 128 bpm.

I know the Subsequent 37 has MIDI and MIDI-via-USB capabilities, but I don't know how to set this up. The manual isn't very helpful to this end, as it just provides a brief description of the MIDI menu parameters. I went to Moog's website and downloaded the "MIDI USB" driver, thinking that once this was installed, my synth would show up in Ableton like my Push 2 does, or perhaps as an "External Instrument". Unfortunately, that was not the case.

Can anyone explain to me what I need to do to set the Moog's Arp bpm via MIDI with my DAW?

If it matters, I'm running Windows 10 on a PC.

Thanks in advance!

--brittonashford
Congrats on the Moog...You'll need some sort of MIDI interface. It can be as simple as something like the Roland UM-ONE mk2. That's what you'll see as a recognized device in Live. Then just create a MIDI track and select the same MIDI output channel as the Moog's (default is 1), and as long as your Live track is playing the clock will sync. To get sound in create an audio track and select the input from your audio interface.

Alternatively you can set up an external instruments. There are pros and cons of each method. Plenty of tutorials on how to do that on YT.

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Post by j bowman » Thu Sep 27, 2018 3:56 am

lumena wrote:Some days I teeter on the brink of selling the Moog. I found myself dreaming of a Lyra 8 and thought is that really a true thing. There is often so much buzz about new synths I forget how much I can do with what I have.
So I decided to approach the Moog differently.

[video][/video]

Guess it's staying for a while longer. All on take reverb from Ableton.
Not to muddy the waters, but... I have a Subsequent 37. Bought a Lyra 8, and my other synths ended up getting neglected, to the point of me thinking I would sell the Moog...

However, a couple of nights ago I ran the Lyra 8 through the external input on the Subsequent 37. Wow - those Lyra voices through the Moog filter (especially with noise or sample and hold modulating the cut off, and a bit of resonance) - it's a great combination, not sure I can sell it now!

Divinital

Post by Divinital » Wed Dec 18, 2019 7:24 pm

A bit late to the party but I'm about to snag a new Subsequent 37 at 15% off... I had the Matriarch, which I absolutely love, however I decided I will get that about a year from now. I want my non-Eurorack hardware synths to have presets, having just started a Eurorack setup today. Love the look and sound of the Subs 37 so I figured I'd snag one to pair with my Summit, I think they have complementary tones...

Yea Moog may release something new soon, or not. Regardless, having not listened to Subs 37 demos for a while until Jexus recently, all listening to Moog videos does is make me realize I pretty much want every Moog I can get.

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Re:

Post by Winglad » Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:42 am

j bowman wrote:
Thu Sep 27, 2018 3:56 am
lumena wrote:Some days I teeter on the brink of selling the Moog. I found myself dreaming of a Lyra 8 and thought is that really a true thing. There is often so much buzz about new synths I forget how much I can do with what I have.
So I decided to approach the Moog differently.

[video][/video]

Guess it's staying for a while longer. All on take reverb from Ableton.
Not to muddy the waters, but... I have a Subsequent 37. Bought a Lyra 8, and my other synths ended up getting neglected, to the point of me thinking I would sell the Moog...

However, a couple of nights ago I ran the Lyra 8 through the external input on the Subsequent 37. Wow - those Lyra voices through the Moog filter (especially with noise or sample and hold modulating the cut off, and a bit of resonance) - it's a great combination, not sure I can sell it now!
I agree with you, J!

Lyra8 and Subsequent37 are a perfect fit...

After I got myself a 2017 Voyager, I thought, I’d sell the Subsequent, but that did not happen yet. I love them both. They each have their unique character and features.

Besides, I think the Sub is still one of the best looking Synths on the market... :love:

Cheers!

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Re: Re:

Post by j bowman » Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:23 pm

Winglad wrote:
Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:42 am
j bowman wrote:
Thu Sep 27, 2018 3:56 am
lumena wrote:Some days I teeter on the brink of selling the Moog. I found myself dreaming of a Lyra 8 and thought is that really a true thing. There is often so much buzz about new synths I forget how much I can do with what I have.
So I decided to approach the Moog differently.

[video][/video]

Guess it's staying for a while longer. All on take reverb from Ableton.
Not to muddy the waters, but... I have a Subsequent 37. Bought a Lyra 8, and my other synths ended up getting neglected, to the point of me thinking I would sell the Moog...

However, a couple of nights ago I ran the Lyra 8 through the external input on the Subsequent 37. Wow - those Lyra voices through the Moog filter (especially with noise or sample and hold modulating the cut off, and a bit of resonance) - it's a great combination, not sure I can sell it now!
I agree with you, J!

Lyra8 and Subsequent37 are a perfect fit...

After I got myself a 2017 Voyager, I thought, I’d sell the Subsequent, but that did not happen yet. I love them both. They each have their unique character and features.

Besides, I think the Sub is still one of the best looking Synths on the market... :love:

Cheers!
Yes the Subsequent 37 is a beautiful looking object. Since my post I forgot about running the Lyra through the SS37 filter - I think filtering might be somewhat against the ethos of the Lyra, however good it sounds!

Recently I have been running the SS37 out through the Lyra drive and delay section, which adds a lot of Soma soul to what some might regard as the more "bland" Sub sound.

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Re: Re:

Post by Winglad » Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:39 pm

j bowman wrote:
Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:23 pm
Winglad wrote:
Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:42 am
j bowman wrote:
Thu Sep 27, 2018 3:56 am
lumena wrote:Some days I teeter on the brink of selling the Moog. I found myself dreaming of a Lyra 8 and thought is that really a true thing. There is often so much buzz about new synths I forget how much I can do with what I have.
So I decided to approach the Moog differently.

[video][/video]

Guess it's staying for a while longer. All on take reverb from Ableton.
Not to muddy the waters, but... I have a Subsequent 37. Bought a Lyra 8, and my other synths ended up getting neglected, to the point of me thinking I would sell the Moog...

However, a couple of nights ago I ran the Lyra 8 through the external input on the Subsequent 37. Wow - those Lyra voices through the Moog filter (especially with noise or sample and hold modulating the cut off, and a bit of resonance) - it's a great combination, not sure I can sell it now!
I agree with you, J!

Lyra8 and Subsequent37 are a perfect fit...

After I got myself a 2017 Voyager, I thought, I’d sell the Subsequent, but that did not happen yet. I love them both. They each have their unique character and features.

Besides, I think the Sub is still one of the best looking Synths on the market... :love:

Cheers!
Yes the Subsequent 37 is a beautiful looking object. Since my post I forgot about running the Lyra through the SS37 filter - I think filtering might be somewhat against the ethos of the Lyra, however good it sounds!

Recently I have been running the SS37 out through the Lyra drive and delay section, which adds a lot of Soma soul to what some might regard as the more "bland" Sub sound.
I know what you mean by Lyra‘s ethos. I almost felt bad running it through external effects since it represents such a formidable entity! And quite often, I enjoy it just being itself.
On the other hand, it is not a “religion” and with its input jacks it even invites transgressions to other instruments/modules...
So I decided not to feel too bad about pairing it and therefore even further broaden the unique sound experience it delivers!

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