Super-awesomest, best reverb module in Eurorack 2022: Starlab, ECR+, Desmodus, et.al.?

[studio460]

I know I've asked this here before but with the arrival of Strymon's new Starlab, I thought I'd ask again. I own a few pretty good-sounding reverb pedals: Eventide Blackhole, Source Audio Collider, Mooer Ocean Machine; but I would like an uber-good reverb module to put in my rack. I actually don't tend to put reverb effects under CV-control, I just tire of fiddling with 1/4" cables, PSUs, and sorely lack the desk space for any more pedals. And as such, I'm very tempted by the new Starlab. I'm looking for huge, spacey, very effect-ey types of reverb, mainly for sound-effects and weird speech/sampling applications.

Starlab does seem to be incredibly feature-rich with a wide range of modes and hands-on controls with a total of 14 knobs, 24 jacks, and a pair of three-position switches. Could this be the most feature-packed reverb module on the market to date? Strymon's demo does sound very impressive:

[everydaycurry]

I’m a big fan of Desmodus, it can range from small and roomy to huge ambient and sounds great doing all of it.

I don’t really CV it, I just tweak by hand.

[burdickjp]

Of the reverbs I've played with, I'm currently on the Desmodus Versio.
I've enjoyed Lich as well, and like that it has attenuverters.
Right now I'm curious about the QuBit Aurora: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/qu-bit-electronix-aurora

[ima_jrk]

Hands down I recommend buying into the Versio platform. Barring that I’m really loving the reverbs in the ALM MFX

[studio460]

Thanks! I just stumbled onto Cinematic Lab's excellent video on the topic which points out that Desmodus is the only reverb which can add distortion to the reverb-tail. I also should've put best in quotes, since "best" depends on what you're after, as the Cinematic Lab video also notes.

[Illwiggle]

I have the Starlab and Desmodus Versio. Different characters. Starlab is fantastic, very versatile and surprising, but it may take some fiddling to get where you wanna go. Desmodus is more immediate for me, and the sound is a bit more extreme in nature.... the Desmodus HOWLS! It can do rudimentary verbs well enuf for me, but it can also go way out there, & give you lots of room to play ‘out there’. The verb on the Verbos Multi-Delay is very nice too, in a similar fantasy vein as the DV but its a one knob effect only on a larger delay based panel.

I havent tried any of the alternate firmwares for the DV cuz the DV is just that good!

I am very interested in the ECR+ as well.

[studio460]

Thanks, man! You're just the person I needed to hear from. I have a Versio, currently loaded with Ruina firmware/front-panel (which I love!), but haven't tried the Desmodus firmware yet. I'm very interested in howling, and super focused on "out-there" stuff. So as usual, the answer is . . . both. I just bought a Magneto, and it seems almost destined to be paired with Starlab (which also seems to get very "out-there"), as again, Cinematic Lab demonstrates:

[paulskiogorki]

I don’t really CV it, I just tweak by hand.

That being the case, do you find the small knobs to be a problem?

[Kent]

I don't own any of the modules that are mentioned here. I would like to put the Z-DSP, from TipTop Audio, forward as a worthwhile unit. Get the SSSR and Valhalla reverbs and away you go.

[Stu B]

Ive had Starlab for a couple of months and its awesome, so many cool things it can do, I really recommend it.

I've got be honest though and say that the lushest, richest sounding reverb from the few i've owned (Starlab, Z5000, Erica Black Hole 2, and an Eventide Black Hole pedal) was the Eventide, I sold it because I really wanted to get everything in the rack and get some CV involved but the pedal was definitely better sound wise. To me anyway.

I hear a lot of good things about Valhalla on the Tiptop Z-DSP.

[emojiseq]

It's the ECR+. I hate how they handled the first version, but here we are. Also recommend the MFX, Dreadbox Splash, Erbe-verb, Z-DSP, even the 2hp is workable. Probably forgetting like 3 others.

E: UAFX Golden Reverberator is the one pedal I kept besides a wah

[ee_]

I myself just got a Starlab. I either have or have owned/used Tiptop ZVerb, FX Aid XL, Xaoc Timizsoara, Make Noise Erbe-Verb, all the Versio reverbs, a Strymon Blue Sky v2 pedal, a Disting Mk4, and probably one or two I'm forgetting.

What I can say even in just my one day overview of the Starlab is that it easily surpasses all the others in terms of its depth as a sound-design tool. It can even be a monophonic synth on its own (which I haven't tried yet, but am looking forward to). I sold off my Blue Sky pedal in part to fund the Starlab, and couldn't be happier with that choice thus far. I haven't had it long enough to give an overall verdict, but what I can say is that it can definitely do very lush, full reverbs, with or without delay effects, and has a lot of depth to its toolset. This is a good thing, but it is a module you won't want to skip reading the manual on. It's physically a beautiful and impressive module as well.

As with the Magneto, one thing I am *not* crazy about is the layout of the jacks. It feels very difficult to find a place for the module in my system where it doesn't end up covered in spaghetti. For some reason both the input and output jacks are on the left, and all the most important CV ins are on the right. Seems very backward to my left-to-right bias and the loosely left-to-right orientation of my system.

If you think Starlab will be over the top for your needs, my next recommendation would definitely be a Versio. You can usually get them secondhand for $300 or less, and since you can load any Versio firmware, having one opens up a lot of possibilities. Electus and Desmodus are the main reverb firmwares, and I prefer Electus I think, but just by a hair ... they're pretty similar, and both nice and full and lush.

Erbe-Verb was also cool, but had a definite sort of cold, metallic, springy character to it. I'd give it my recommendation if you think you'll get on with its sound, but I prefer Versio myself.

All the others that I mentioned were, to me, usable for basic reverb stuff, but nothing to really write home about and on a lower tier.

[Black_Materia]

I've said a few times here i really didn't like starlab much. I mean, it's certainly not a bad reverb for the eurorack platform, but at that pricepoint it is competing with high end pedals, and it really doesn't win in that competition.
My main reasons i sold it: It doesn't gell or mix well. The algorythms are in a way quite limited, it all sounds the same. If you need a big wash of reverb, no problem. Subtle sparkle, meh. The predelay has no amplitude knob or cv control, the lfo bleeds into the modulation routing even when off (try it, set it on a high rate and route it to pitch, turn the amount off, and you will still hear a pitch warble) And It has a tendency to build up mid frequencies, and becomes honky, nasal and muddy.

I mostly prefer ITB reverbs like Valhalla's, I also have a Big Sky and an Eventide H90. I just have multiple outputs dotted around the system. This way i can mix & multitrack record dry, add reverb and change it after the facts. It also gives the distinct advantage of mixing and sending different elements (some drums, vocals, piano etc) to the same effect or effect chain, making things blend better and glue more in a mix

In eurorack, i have an analogue spring reverb with three size tanks, a dreadbox Splash (lovely grimy mono reverb, perfect for dark drones and doesn't take over the stereo image that other elements get from a wide hifi reverb) And the Arbhar's reverb which is just the purest hifi-clean everlasting sparkling tail, perfect for granular stuff. And i love the spring reverb on Magneto.

So my advice would be to get a pedal instead, if you are doing dawless stuff or performances.

[bkbirge]

To me reverb is one of those things that is really tricky to get sounding good. I tend to stay away from pedal based things, though that may just be old man bias as I'm sure things have gotten a lot better since the caveman days.

I do have a Tiptop Z-DSP that's pretty fantastic with Valhalla and I like the Rainmaker on productions sometimes, yes it's a delay but can do some great short rooms through the feedback network. They both hang with my high dollar Lexicon units pretty nicely. Got a couple spring units in euro also, they do the spring thing just fine, exactly what's needed sometimes, most times not, lol.

Still, my preference out of all of them is an actual real room, running speakers out to it with a pair of mics and it's instant unique ambience. Of course if I need a big giant cathedral that's why I've got Valhalla or long delays. Not a big fan of the cavernous wash out usually though, homogenizes everything too much.

[morphmuse]

Tasty Chips ECR+

It's the one and only Eurorack reverb module for me.

[BLogic12]

Recently sold my starlab for an eventide H90. Lacks cv inputs (well has 1) but I like it quite a bit more. Super flexible and much wider variety of sounds.

[LordKrud]

If you like something wild and out there Qubit Aurora. Not the most flexible but you can tame it. But also go absolutely nuts.

It is totally not for everyone.

[Jarls]

I am on the same "quest". I have ordered an ECR+ and expect to receive it this week.
Unsure if it will fulfill my expectations as there are not that many videos demoing it out there. What intrigues me is that it is a different (albeit not new) take on generating reverbs from what I already have (Aurora - FFT based, and various algorithmic based reverbs - such as FX aid).
Will find out!

[Mjdn]

Really interesting discussion here. Starlab had been on my wishlist for a while. I had discounted the Tip tip module for some reason that I can't remember now. I had assumed it wouldn't have the processing power to run something like valhalla - didn't realise it came as stock. Have any if you encountered any hardware limitations when running custom algos?

[johnny_infinity]

I have desmodus versio, amazing, but... there is a bouncing ball bit of the reverb that gets repetitive.

I have the doepfer spring reverb, amazing but noisy.

I also have bunker archeology, which has a belton brick so gives that classic pedal reverb vibe. one of my favorite lofi modules.

My brother has the pedal version of big sky, and it sounds fantastic.

I am not impressed with the reverb on the disting ex, neither am I impressed with the happy nerding ones. I would only use them really early on in the signal chain.

[ee_]

I have desmodus versio, amazing, but... there is a bouncing ball bit of the reverb that gets repetitive.

Funny you mention this, I was just noticing this the other day. It's the main reason I prefer Electus. Electus does that too (if I'm thinking of the same thing you're referencing) but I actually feel like I have more control over its impact on the sound with Electus.

[Jee]

Interesting topic as i've also been looking for a reverb I can modulate in eurorack.
I spent ages finding the pedal reverb I like, essentially because there's way too many goodreverb pedals.
Finally I got a CXM1978.

Now I feel like I'm struggling to find an appealing reverb in eurorack essentially because of the lack of good modules!

Ideally I want a reverb that can do crazy stuff, pure sound design tool, CV etc. and if possible, lush long verbs.
I finally tried the ECR+ because convolution has the potential to do that all.
Gosh! What a deception. Yes it can do some (dark) long verbs but the sound overall was not so pleasing except for a few dark (pitched down) impulsions. Very metallic, digital and cold sounds. it reminds you permanently that you deal with a digital module. Average internal gain staging. At least they put an auto-gain compensation at the output which also serves as speaker-saver when the module glitches randomly when modulated or creates a massive resonant spike (especially valid when you sample the same the source and use it as impulsion as there are frequencies boost occuring).
I found the module really lack fun, immediacy and more importantly a good and varied sound.
I A/B'ed it against the CXM1978 and it was just hilarious. Not mentioning UI.
It's going back to the shop.

But some interesting options above like the Arbhar's reverb that I didn't even know exist, thanks @Black_Materia
Desmodus Versio probably worth the try with a second hand module I believe, probably my next move.

or perhaps I can just do nothing and forget about eurorack reverb as I fear the competitor I have at home might put the comparison level too high :s
But I want some "large space modulated craziness" happening. reverbs at the core of sound design instead of the classic end of the chain use is so good and inspiring...
and eurorack is such a good place for this!!

edit:
re-reading my comment on ECR+ it's valid but kind of harsh / unfair: it's a deception for ME. That said to point out some + points it the fade between 2 convolutions is quite cool and there are some really nice sweet spots but more on the very dark ambiance reverb side (pitched down).

[analogbrainsurgeon]

Interesting topic as i've also been looking for a reverb I can modulate in eurorack.
I spent ages finding the pedal reverb I like, essentially because there's way too many goodreverb pedals.
Finally I got a CXM1978.

Now I feel like I'm struggling to find an appealing reverb in eurorack essentially because of the lack of good modules!

Ideally I want a reverb that can do crazy stuff, pure sound design tool, CV etc. and if possible, lush long verbs.
I finally tried the ECR+ because convolution has the potential to do that all.
Gosh! What a deception. Yes it can do some (dark) long verbs but the sound overall was not so pleasing except for a few dark (pitched down) impulsions. Very metallic, digital and cold sounds. it reminds you permanently that you deal with a digital module. Average internal gain staging. At least they put an auto-gain compensation at the output which also serves as speaker-saver when the module glitches randomly when modulated or creates a massive resonant spike (especially valid when you sample the same the source and use it as impulsion as there are frequencies boost occuring).
I found the module really lack fun, immediacy and more importantly a good and varied sound.
I A/B'ed it against the CXM1978 and it was just hilarious. Not mentioning UI.
It's going back to the shop.

But some interesting options above like the Arbhar's reverb that I didn't even know exist, thanks @Black_Materia
Desmodus Versio probably worth the try with a second hand module I believe, probably my next move.

or perhaps I can just do nothing and forget about eurorack reverb as I fear the competitor I have at home might put the comparison level too high :s
But I want some "large space modulated craziness" happening. reverbs at the core of sound design instead of the classic end of the chain use is so good and inspiring...
and eurorack is such a good place for this!!

edit:
re-reading my comment on ECR+ it's valid but kind of harsh / unfair: it's a deception for ME. That said to point out some + points it the fade between 2 convolutions is quite cool and there are some really nice sweet spots but more on the very dark ambiance reverb side (pitched down).

Hey, thanks for your detailed review. I was an early CXM adopter and it's really a great pedal, isn't it? I have Starlab and I like that a lot. E520 also has some unique reverbs in it, to do weirder stiff with, and some short convolutions. I have had my eye on the ECR+ since the original ECR and its dramatic evolution. Without your description I probably would have eventually tried one out, but the things you described are exactly what I don't like in a reverb. Have you tried Starlab? Also, have you tried CVing the CXM? I haven't gotten around to that yet, but I should do an experiment soon.

[LordKrud]

Update to my previous post.
Qu-bit Aurora with the FDN Verb firmware.
Nice reverb. Not as nuts as the normal fw.
More tame but can still get deep.

[Peng33]

My only dedicated reverb module is Afterneath, so I have nothing to compare it against. I recently purchased a Versio module specifically for the Polydactyl firmware, but have yet to try the Desmodus firmware. So can anyone with more Euro reverb experience than I do do a light comparison between these two (I am not financially in the space to purchase another) and other options on the market?

I'm not going to buy another, but want to know if these two are adequate choices, relative to what else is out there.