Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

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dgrainger
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by dgrainger »

Aw, 266t has been pushed back to December, according to tiptop's buchla page.
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bhmcc
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

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:despair:
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exper
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by exper »

dgrainger wrote: Wed Nov 09, 2022 6:57 am Aw, 266t has been pushed back to December, according to tiptop's buchla page.
Bummer. I was hoping it was going to be out imminently.
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by The Junglechrist »

Hey there euro Buchla folks! I prepared a video about all my favorite tricks with the 257t and 245t that I've seen in recent Todd Barton's videos (or from others).
Feel free to come say hi or ask any questions during the premiere tomorow at 18:30 French time ;-)
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adnauseam
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by adnauseam »

I've been using a couple of 257t modules in a new rack configuration.

My most frustrating observations are:
  • There's no attenuator for the crossfade cv input
  • Voffset is only 0-10 and no option of -5/+5,
  • and lastly: I do not at all understand the point of the +5V offset switch for the middle section. The graphic seems to imply this (5V? or is it 4V? What is .5?!?) appears at Vb. I'm not really sure of the utility of this. Does it mean that at 12 o'clock, (50% Vb / 50% Vc) a signal incoming at Vc is offset by 0.5 (4V?)
Are there any tricks, other than using both channels, or utilizing the first section, to get negative offsets? :help:

Using the 257t with Ornament and Crime has proven difficult as inputs are expecting -3V to +6V. I know this is where having a susinct and coordinating engineering philosophy helps. The TT Buchla modules all work very well together.. *Grumble* something someting standards *Grumble*.

--I'll stop myself here from getting into a rant about problems with Euro pairings and instead bite my tongue. :doh:
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feelingthin
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by feelingthin »

Does anyone know what the expected cv value is for the crossfader cv on the 257t? It's not listed in the manual. Is is -5v/5v or -10v/10v?
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adnauseam
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by adnauseam »

feelingthin wrote: Tue Nov 15, 2022 6:43 pm Does anyone know what the expected cv value is for the crossfader cv on the 257t? It's not listed in the manual. Is is -5v/5v or -10v/10v?
Or -8V/8V??!
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feelingthin
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by feelingthin »

adnauseam wrote: Tue Nov 15, 2022 9:22 pm
feelingthin wrote: Tue Nov 15, 2022 6:43 pm Does anyone know what the expected cv value is for the crossfader cv on the 257t? It's not listed in the manual. Is is -5v/5v or -10v/10v?
Or -8V/8V??!
Or 0v. I would make modules with useless inputs just to throw people off. In all seriousness, it's probably -5/5v I just want to check.
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Spanningtree
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by Spanningtree »

It appears to be 0 to 9 or 10v. I tried negative as well with no result, unless I did something wrong.

For this setup:
Channel A connected to Vout
Channel B connected to Vb <-- Saw wave
Channel C connected to Vc <-- Sine wave
Channel D connected to Xfade in (second half of the 257t Voffset and used it as a 0 to 10v source)

Xfade in at about 0v, Vout is strong saw:
1.jpeg
Xfade in at about 5v, Vout showing transformation to sine (caught the sample off a bit, shrug):
2.jpeg
Xfade in at about 8v, Vout still showing some saw in the troughs:
3.jpeg
Xfade in at about 9v, Vout looks pretty sine (zoom would be cool, IDK):
4.jpeg
Xfade in at about 10v, Vout is similar to 9v output:
5.jpeg
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feelingthin
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by feelingthin »

Thanks! Where was the crossfade knob position? If fully counter clockwise, then a 0-10v envelope would fully crossfade to the other signal and mean it's -5/5v. So, if the knob is in the middle, it acts as an offset and a 5v lfo swings to Vb at -5 and Vc at +5. Or does the knob not act as an offset and I should use an envelope or bipolar lfo at 10v to crossfade fully?? That's the question
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Spanningtree
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by Spanningtree »

feelingthin wrote: Tue Nov 15, 2022 11:20 pm Thanks! Where was the crossfade knob position? If fully counter clockwise, then a 0-10v envelope would fully crossfade to the other signal and mean it's -5/5v. So, if the knob is in the middle, it acts as an offset and a 5v lfo swings to Vb at -5 and Vc at +5. Or does the knob not act as an offset and I should use an envelope or bipolar lfo at 10v to crossfade fully?? That's the question
Broke the lab setup down for the night but the knob was fully ccw during those shots. Hope that helps! Might take a another look tomorrow, time permitting.
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feelingthin
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by feelingthin »

Spanningtree wrote: Tue Nov 15, 2022 11:26 pm
feelingthin wrote: Tue Nov 15, 2022 11:20 pm Thanks! Where was the crossfade knob position? If fully counter clockwise, then a 0-10v envelope would fully crossfade to the other signal and mean it's -5/5v. So, if the knob is in the middle, it acts as an offset and a 5v lfo swings to Vb at -5 and Vc at +5. Or does the knob not act as an offset and I should use an envelope or bipolar lfo at 10v to crossfade fully?? That's the question
Broke the lab setup down for the night but the knob was fully ccw during those shots. Hope that helps! Might take a another look tomorrow, time permitting.
Thank you! That was very helpful! I have so many different voltages in my system, and just trying to match them correctly,
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adnauseam
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by adnauseam »

feelingthin wrote: Wed Nov 16, 2022 1:38 am
Spanningtree wrote: Tue Nov 15, 2022 11:26 pm
feelingthin wrote: Tue Nov 15, 2022 11:20 pm Thanks! Where was the crossfade knob position? If fully counter clockwise, then a 0-10v envelope would fully crossfade to the other signal and mean it's -5/5v. So, if the knob is in the middle, it acts as an offset and a 5v lfo swings to Vb at -5 and Vc at +5. Or does the knob not act as an offset and I should use an envelope or bipolar lfo at 10v to crossfade fully?? That's the question
Broke the lab setup down for the night but the knob was fully ccw during those shots. Hope that helps! Might take a another look tomorrow, time permitting.
Thank you! That was very helpful! I have so many different voltages in my system, and just trying to match them correctly,
Recently I've been thinking about how nice it would be to measure and catalogue modules voltage expectations. Many times I've wondered why certain modules don't trigger others or wondered if I'm getting the full control over CV inputs with some of my modules.

Having this kind of information would also help make decisions about module pairings.
oliverkollar
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by oliverkollar »

feelingthin wrote: Tue Nov 15, 2022 6:43 pm Does anyone know what the expected cv value is for the crossfader cv on the 257t? It's not listed in the manual. Is is -5v/5v or -10v/10v?
0-10v

If you have the crossfader knob at 7:00, 10v will open it fully to 5:00.
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feelingthin
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by feelingthin »

Perfect, thanks!
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topherc
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by topherc »

Has anyone else noticed a difference in triggers between modules in the range. The end of cycles triggers of the 281t won't trigger a few of my modules but the triggers from the 245t (i.e. pulse out or stage outs) trigger the same modules fine...
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mritenburg
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by mritenburg »

topherc wrote: Thu Nov 17, 2022 2:40 pm Has anyone else noticed a difference in triggers between modules in the range. The end of cycles triggers of the 281t won't trigger a few of my modules but the triggers from the 245t (i.e. pulse out or stage outs) trigger the same modules fine...
This is true of the 4U versions as well. There are a variety of pulse shapes implemented across the Buchla product line that result in triggering anomalies. There is a chart that floats around in posts here showing the pulse shapes across different modules in the Buchla product line.
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topherc
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by topherc »

mritenburg wrote: Thu Nov 17, 2022 2:47 pm
topherc wrote: Thu Nov 17, 2022 2:40 pm Has anyone else noticed a difference in triggers between modules in the range. The end of cycles triggers of the 281t won't trigger a few of my modules but the triggers from the 245t (i.e. pulse out or stage outs) trigger the same modules fine...
This is true of the 4U versions as well. There are a variety of pulse shapes implemented across the Buchla product line that result in triggering anomalies. There is a chart that floats around in posts here showing the pulse shapes across different modules in the Buchla product line.
Interesting. Thanks. I wonder why Tiptop decided not to iron out those sorts of things.
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cscairney
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by cscairney »

can anyone attest to those quirks adding to the buchla 200 character? or is it just more frustrating than anything?
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by ProggyBoog »

topherc wrote: Thu Nov 17, 2022 3:54 pm Interesting. Thanks. I wonder why Tiptop decided not to iron out those sorts of things.
I believe the goal has been to get the entire experience as accurate to the originals as possible. Even to the level of not providing manuals of any use whatsoever.
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mritenburg
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by mritenburg »

cscairney wrote: Thu Nov 17, 2022 3:57 pm can anyone attest to those quirks adding to the buchla 200 character? or is it just more frustrating than anything?
It’s just how it is. It’s generally not a big deal in Buchla 200 4U which is mostly(though not entirely) a closed format. Overall, the unique character and craziness that can result from patching a nice collection of Buchla 200 modules greatly outweighs this particular quirk.

I can see how in euro this can be more frustrating, however this issue comes up when mixing other brands of euro modules anyway.
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by luketeaford »

ProggyBoog wrote: Thu Nov 17, 2022 4:52 pm
topherc wrote: Thu Nov 17, 2022 3:54 pm Interesting. Thanks. I wonder why Tiptop decided not to iron out those sorts of things.
I believe the goal has been to get the entire experience as accurate to the originals as possible. Even to the level of not providing manuals of any use whatsoever.
I am a Buchla skeptic but the TipTop manuals are pretty useful and the modules are way more fun than I expected.
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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by The Junglechrist »

Hey there folks,
I've made this little thing on my Tracker, using only samples from the tips & tricks video I linked earlier about the 245t and 257t.
Those TT / Buchla stuff are simple awesome.

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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by samuelous »

Too bad the 292t & 266t aren't released yet, until I have the complete set I've decided to complement the modules with a MI Ripples, works pretty good even though its more in the subtractive realm.

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Re: Buchla 200 in Euro format (Tiptop)

Post by luketeaford »

samuelous wrote: Mon Nov 21, 2022 1:27 pm Too bad the 292t & 266t aren't released yet, until I have the complete set I've decided to complement the modules with a MI Ripples, works pretty good even though its more in the subtractive realm.

Welcome to the forum! Cool jam-- cool to have 2 nice oscillators for the size and price and you can even sorta get some subtractive synth action going with CV of the shape crossfader...
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