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New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

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continuum
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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by continuum » Mon Apr 27, 2020 8:30 am

Building up a reggae tune track by track:

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www.tiptopaudio.com/

Control
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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by Control » Tue Apr 28, 2020 6:01 pm

Has anyone seen either of these for sale at an online modular store?

continuum
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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by continuum » Wed Apr 29, 2020 8:09 am

Control wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 6:01 pm
Has anyone seen either of these for sale at an online modular store?
A quick check right now shows some stock at Perfect Circuit, Sweetwater, Gear4Music, Musicstore.de, Signal Sounds, etc.
Tiptop Audio R&D
www.tiptopaudio.com/

Control
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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by Control » Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:25 pm

Oh great. Thank you so much!

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tdallas
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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by tdallas » Thu Apr 30, 2020 4:33 pm

Misread ... please ignore.

s/t

Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by s/t » Sat May 09, 2020 3:48 pm

These are sounding really good!

I'm not intimate with the technical aspects of the FV-1 chip, but am curious as to whether the filter section is implemented within the algorithm or an analogue filter as part of an external feedback loop.

Thank you :)

continuum
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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by continuum » Sun May 10, 2020 3:14 pm

s/t wrote:
Sat May 09, 2020 3:48 pm
These are sounding really good!

I'm not intimate with the technical aspects of the FV-1 chip, but am curious as to whether the filter section is implemented within the algorithm or an analogue filter as part of an external feedback loop.

Thank you :)
The filter is done in DSP on all of the programs.
Tiptop Audio R&D
www.tiptopaudio.com/

s/t

Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by s/t » Mon May 11, 2020 5:16 pm

continuum wrote:
Sun May 10, 2020 3:14 pm
s/t wrote:
Sat May 09, 2020 3:48 pm
These are sounding really good!

I'm not intimate with the technical aspects of the FV-1 chip, but am curious as to whether the filter section is implemented within the algorithm or an analogue filter as part of an external feedback loop.

Thank you :)
The filter is done in DSP on all of the programs.
Thank you so much for your response -that’s a pretty impressive chip!

I’d love to hear more about your inspirations regarding particular algorithms. This is why I love this community -you get to talk to the people who designed the things we use :)

continuum
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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by continuum » Wed May 13, 2020 9:27 am

s/t wrote:
Mon May 11, 2020 5:16 pm
I’d love to hear more about your inspirations regarding particular algorithms. This is why I love this community -you get to talk to the people who designed the things we use :)
Any algorithms in particular?

In general, nothing is a direct emulation/clone/port of an existing product. I have a few old boxes around for reference like a PCM 80 and DSP 4000, but most of the algorithm design comes from researching the designers and the technology of the era and/or listening to records. The 'Tape' echo was tuned with records - if it started to sound like a King Tubby or Lee Perry record then that was a good sign.
Tiptop Audio R&D
www.tiptopaudio.com/

s/t

Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by s/t » Wed May 13, 2020 12:01 pm

Hi continuum,

Thank you for replying -that awesome that you were tuning the delay to King Tubby, I’m a bit of a dub fiend!

I’m a little familiar with algorithms made by guys like Schroeder, Moorer, Dattorro, and a my favourite reverb is the Quadraverb (love that Chorusstrings2 algorithm -it’s so organic, just feeding it a bass drum you get all these strange background noises and modulations happening, as if there’s some field recording being sent into it.)

So yeh I guess I’m just curious about how you develop your reverbs, what it is about reverb that excites you (if it does!)

Many thanks!


continuum
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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by continuum » Fri May 15, 2020 9:32 am

s/t wrote:
Wed May 13, 2020 12:01 pm
Hi continuum,

Thank you for replying -that awesome that you were tuning the delay to King Tubby, I’m a bit of a dub fiend!

I’m a little familiar with algorithms made by guys like Schroeder, Moorer, Dattorro, and a my favourite reverb is the Quadraverb (love that Chorusstrings2 algorithm -it’s so organic, just feeding it a bass drum you get all these strange background noises and modulations happening, as if there’s some field recording being sent into it.)

So yeh I guess I’m just curious about how you develop your reverbs, what it is about reverb that excites you (if it does!)

Many thanks!
The papers and publicly available documents on reverb design are only starting points. The main thing to learn from them is what they leave out, and the parts they leave out are the most important ones (i.e. 'secret sauce'). Researching the hardware used in old gear can also be pretty enlightening.

I haven't used a Quadraverb in about 25 years and can't comment on that, but two of the 80s algorithms are inspired by Alesis: BarrVerb is based on reading Keith Barr's thoughts on reverb structures and also the design of the original Alesis DSP and the Spin FV-1 (he did both and also founded MXR in the 70s). The other is the 'reverse' Bloom algorithm from the MIDIVerb which doesn't quite do what people think it does. I didn't reference a MIDIVerb unit but used what I think Keith did for the structure and math and tuned it a bit from a bit of Kevin Shields. In both cases the controls and capabilities are much expanded over the originals.
Tiptop Audio R&D
www.tiptopaudio.com/

s/t

Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by s/t » Sat May 16, 2020 5:03 am

continuum wrote:
Fri May 15, 2020 9:32 am
s/t wrote:
Wed May 13, 2020 12:01 pm
Hi continuum,

Thank you for replying -that awesome that you were tuning the delay to King Tubby, I’m a bit of a dub fiend!

I’m a little familiar with algorithms made by guys like Schroeder, Moorer, Dattorro, and a my favourite reverb is the Quadraverb (love that Chorusstrings2 algorithm -it’s so organic, just feeding it a bass drum you get all these strange background noises and modulations happening, as if there’s some field recording being sent into it.)

So yeh I guess I’m just curious about how you develop your reverbs, what it is about reverb that excites you (if it does!)

Many thanks!
The papers and publicly available documents on reverb design are only starting points. The main thing to learn from them is what they leave out, and the parts they leave out are the most important ones (i.e. 'secret sauce'). Researching the hardware used in old gear can also be pretty enlightening.

I haven't used a Quadraverb in about 25 years and can't comment on that, but two of the 80s algorithms are inspired by Alesis: BarrVerb is based on reading Keith Barr's thoughts on reverb structures and also the design of the original Alesis DSP and the Spin FV-1 (he did both and also founded MXR in the 70s). The other is the 'reverse' Bloom algorithm from the MIDIVerb which doesn't quite do what people think it does. I didn't reference a MIDIVerb unit but used what I think Keith did for the structure and math and tuned it a bit from a bit of Kevin Shields. In both cases the controls and capabilities are much expanded over the originals.
Thank you very much for your reply. I got my hands on the Z5000 yesterday and it's got a fab collection of algorithms -I especially like the Room reverb, which has this really interesting swirly ringing thing happening when the time is set to full :tu:

continuum
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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by continuum » Sat May 16, 2020 9:14 am

The Room algorithm is not as stable as others like Hall or Plate so higher Time settings bring it closer to self oscillation. The Mod control can help reduce the ringing and at higher settings gets pretty chorused. Most Room reverbs don't have any modulation control or even modulation at all.

An early version of Room had a Size control instead of Mod but the Fidelity control works pretty much the same way by increasing the delay times as the sampling rate decreases.
Tiptop Audio R&D
www.tiptopaudio.com/

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gloamtrotter
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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by gloamtrotter » Sat May 16, 2020 6:54 pm

Anyone know if anymore black Zverbs are on the way? I've been striking out for months

continuum
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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by continuum » Sun May 17, 2020 11:18 am

gloamtrotter wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 6:54 pm
Anyone know if anymore black Zverbs are on the way? I've been striking out for months
Thomann might have some.
Tiptop Audio R&D
www.tiptopaudio.com/

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gloamtrotter
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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by gloamtrotter » Mon May 18, 2020 11:42 am

They did have one, and I was already planning to place an order with them so it worked out well. Thanks for the tip

continuum
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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by continuum » Fri Jun 19, 2020 9:00 am

SOS review for those that still like old style print:

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/ti ... choz-z5000

Also, dealers should be restocking the latest batch of these now. They are still selling faster than we can make them (limited by our supply chain).
Tiptop Audio R&D
www.tiptopaudio.com/

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Multi Grooves
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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by Multi Grooves » Wed Sep 09, 2020 2:42 pm

Franktree wrote:
Thu Apr 02, 2020 12:59 pm
tta wrote:
Thu Apr 02, 2020 11:11 am
Franktree wrote:
Wed Apr 01, 2020 5:19 pm
Anyone know when these will be back in stock? I've had one on order with Perfect Circuit since Jan 1, but am still waiting.
I’m sorry for delays, we have a combination of high demand but also longer than usual time to get the parts that goes into these effect modules. We should have more ready to ship by April 15.
No worries. Delays are all that can be expected at times like this. Just helpful to have an update. Thanks.

I C WAT U DID THERE...
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continuum
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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by continuum » Tue Nov 03, 2020 12:05 pm

Some more video demos from DivKid and the Patchwerks store in Seattle:



Tiptop Audio R&D
www.tiptopaudio.com/

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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by jones » Sat Jan 09, 2021 1:26 pm

Must say having had this echoz module for a good while the output levels are a pain point - the whole end-of-chain thing is a bit lame - the eurorack standard is hot outputs - so now there's modules with levels for inside a patch and different ones for the end of the chain??? - any mixer or interface I have had worked fine with euro signals - the module is always out of whack levels wise in my system/patches. The input distorts easily with digital noise from standard euro signals and the output is too weak going into my stereo reverb module. Pity as I like the shimmer delay.

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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by miminashi » Sat Jan 09, 2021 2:46 pm

I dunno, jones. I have a ZVERB and the levels seem fine to me, but I am also using it on a send in a more end-of-chain way. The manual lists the input range for these modules as 12V peak-to-peak and the output range as 10V peak-to-peak, which I would consider to be within the "standard" (which doesn't exist, by the way). You shouldn't be surprised when hitting a digital input stage with a signal outside of its range results in unpleasant distortion.

FWIW, I have fully analog modules (some filters in particular) that will distort unpleasantly with the full output of some VCOs. That's why I like inputs with attenuators. Conversely, you sometimes need to boost signals a bit. That's why I like inputs with gain. 8-)

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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by vytis » Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:59 am

continuum wrote:
Tue Nov 03, 2020 12:05 pm
Some more video demos from DivKid and the Patchwerks store in Seattle:
I can't find the answer, perhaps you have this information?

Is Dry/Wet analog? That is, when fully Dry, is the signal going through the DSP chip, or completely unaffected?
Thank you!

continuum
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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by continuum » Thu Jan 21, 2021 11:18 am

vytis wrote:
Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:59 am
continuum wrote:
Tue Nov 03, 2020 12:05 pm
Some more video demos from DivKid and the Patchwerks store in Seattle:
I can't find the answer, perhaps you have this information?

Is Dry/Wet analog? That is, when fully Dry, is the signal going through the DSP chip, or completely unaffected?
Thank you!
Wet/dry mix is analog.
Tiptop Audio R&D
www.tiptopaudio.com/

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vytis
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Re: New FX modules from Tiptop Audio - ZVERB ECHOZ Z5000

Post by vytis » Thu Jan 21, 2021 2:00 pm

continuum wrote:
Thu Jan 21, 2021 11:18 am
Wet/dry mix is analog.
Many thanks for your prompt reply. Very, very cool. I'm in!

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